Since I'm not sure that anyone's reading that 6-month-old Class Feedback thread, I wanted to give my (decidedly non-traditional) take on the Survival Hunter and how I'd like it to take shape in the future. I'd love to know if there are other Hunters out there that play this sort of style, but I'm not really interested in the inevitable "you're-not-doing-it-right" responses. It is an exciting way to play the class, and I challenge you to find anyone who's run a Heroic with me that doesn't consider what I do to be incredibly effective. This is a copy/paste of my feedback:

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Q u o t e:

List your primary talent tree(s), i.e. Holy/Disc.

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• Survival (11/0/50)

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Q u o t e:

List the content you're primarily pursuing or most enjoy, i.e. Raiding, PvP, Solo, etc...

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• Heroic dungeons


• Wishing my playstyle was more desirable in raids.

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Q u o t e:

Provide a brief description of the areas you feel are most in need of improvement (you may list a maximum of three issues and each issue should be described in one or two sentences).

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• Allow me to USE my Survivability - I love that I can tank in an emergency for Heroics with high HP and avoidance, but it's extremely difficult to hold agro once I have it (since the target is now in melee range). This usually rules out this aspect (my most favorite) of the class in raids, too, where I'm expected to be just another DPS bot.


• Stop putting garbage stats on my gear - I want STA, AGI, and +crit. You can take your +atk and INT and stuff it, or better yet, turn it into +dodge, +parry, and +defense. I don't want them, so stop sacrificing what I need by sticking them on every piece of equipment I can get. Bring back "of the Monkey" gear; I wore the scarce bits I was able to get my hands on in TBC for longer than anything else, but have never once even cared about a PvE armor raid token.


• More utility! - I consider my role to be one of "smoothing out the rough edges" in encounters. Tanking, CC, a quick burst of DPS: whatever is needed when it all hits the fan, I can throw myself into it and leave the group thinking nothing ever went wrong. I love it, and I want more! >8)

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Q u o t e:

List up to five specific spells/abilities/talents you feel most need change, redesign or improvement in the order you feel each is most in need of attention. (MOST to LESS)

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• Mongoose Bite - Simply let me keep agro with it. The fact that I'm using it means I already have it, anyway, and probably don't desire to let it go (else I would have opted to FD rather than pop the mob for a hundred or so damage). Increasing emphasis on dodging/avoidance and adding abilities along this theme (not necessarily straight damage, as I'm not in any way interested in being melee DPS) would do a great deal in giving Survival Hunters a real identity.


• Distracting Shot - Along the same vein, a talent to improve this would be grand. Giving it a taunt-like mechanic would be even better, and would be extra-handy in tandem with Freezing Trap (trying to position something for trapping with a Paladin tank is an exercise in frustration).


• Explosive Trap - Again, a threat bonus or increased damage would be great. Giant AE pulls with doubled-up Explosive Traps and Deterrence is all kinds of fun...until the Mage grabs agro. Won't somebody please think of the Mages!?!

That's about it, really. I'm sure things like "more DPS" are covered in plenty of other posts in this thread. While such things are always nice, being a DPS machine just isn't very fun, and there are two other Hunter trees already dedicated to it. The DPS support from Expose Weakness is the type of thing that works just right for me: I'm more concerned about the prospect of Death Knights squeezing me out of the already-limited opportunities to exhibit the SURVIVABILITY that I have now.

Thanks for listening!

Mynithrosil of Feathermoon
Grand Marshal of the Alliance

(edit: Frost Trap -> Freezing Trap >8P)

Tanking hunter?

your unique approach to this class is doomed to endless flaming and bashing, usually of bad quality and not entertaining.
I don't see the purpose of trying to improve hunters' tanking abilities, when there are (enough) classes/specs specifically designed for tanking.

Yeah, yeah, I'm ready for the flames. I've got plenty of hitpoints, eh? >8)

Lots of classes are built for extended tanking roles, but Survival Hunters have great potential to fill in short gaps. When something goes whack and the tank hits the dirt, and the raid needs a minute to regroup on the fly, THAT's where I can step in. Being able to pick up Magtheridon when the original tank gets squished, holding on to him for a minute or so while another tank builds threat, and then handing it off to him with Feign Death is what I can bring to the raid that others cannot. It is also incredibly fun!

-Myn

Holy 14k health Batman

I cant belive i just read this. A TANKING HUNTER? /facepalm... Hunters wonder why they get called huntards...for this very reason. If i were ever in a grp were I ever had to tank somthing i would leave the group in a heart beat. Then there is the simple fact that 5 man heroics dont matter, you dont see anyone going OMG (insert guild name) just cleared Slave Pens, Mech, and Underbog in under an hour and a half. It's all about progression and 25mans and franklly all of what the OP just said is absolutley useless in a raid. Bottom line Hunters arn't tanks if you want to be a tank i suggest rolling a pally, druid or warrior, or hey when WOLKT comes out turn your hunter into a DK and tank, I think we would all love that one less Huntard in the world.

There is so much /facepalm in this thread.

Wow just looked at your armory...what guild carried you all the way to hyjil, I hope you didnt buy a hutner on ebay that had Ring of the Stalwart Protector. That would be absoulutley terrible if there was another huntard like you out there, well atleast the other one would have sold his acct.

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Q u o t e:
I cant belive i just read this. A TANKING HUNTER? /facepalm... Hunters wonder why they get called huntards...for this very reason. If i were ever in a grp were I ever had to tank somthing i would leave the group in a heart beat. Then there is the simple fact that 5 man heroics dont matter, you dont see anyone going OMG (insert guild name) just cleared Slave Pens, Mech, and Underbog in under an hour and a half. It's all about progression and 25mans and franklly all of what the OP just said is absolutley useless in a raid. Bottom line Hunters arn't tanks if you want to be a tank i suggest rolling a pally, druid or warrior, or hey when WOLKT comes out turn your hunter into a DK and tank, I think we would all love that one less Huntard in the world.

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Funny, since most people who have seen me play have said it gives them a whole new respect for what a Hunter can do. The 'Huntards' are the ones who can't see past the end of their gun barrel. A good Survival Hunter can lock down three to four solid targets in a Heroic instance, or one (if un-CCable) to three (for e.g. Moroes) in a raid. There aren't many who would do Magister's Terrace Heroic with a Warrior tank and only a Hunter for crowd control, but we've done it routinely that way since its inception.

The topic was feedback on what would make Hunters better and/or more fun. It's not just about tanking, but the situations that I find most difficult to handle with this type of play generally involve melee-range threat. Traps rely on being able to position mobs, and the best way to get them where I want them is to have them hating me. Hunters can do very well making sure the right mobs are hitting (or not hitting) the right people, but where it collapses is when the mobs are close and we want them to (continue to) hit us (for even a few seconds) to save someone extra-squishy. Hence, that's where my feedback is mainly focused.

The gear concerns are because I don't really care about DPS; my groups value me for other things. Defensive bonuses would help keep me alive to do them, but the stat distributions that interest me are invariably found on plate or leather items.

I ain't askin' to take away anything from the DPS Hunters. I just would love to see a better-defined identity for Survival Hunters, and this is the one that I've found the most fun. I don't like that there is but one gear set for PvE Hunters, whereas most classes have two or even three.

-Myn

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Q u o t e:
Nice spec, nice points, nice RaP.


I guess even Grand Marshals go for sale on Ebay.

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I led a team that produced no less than fifteen Grand Marshals through skill, tactics, and good teamwork. Bash my playstyle all you want, but don't you dare question my right to hold this title. I worked darn hard to earn it.

-Myn

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Q u o t e:


Funny, since most people who have seen me play have said it gives them a whole new respect for what a Hunter can do. The 'Huntards' are the ones who can't see past the end of their gun barrel. A good Survival Hunter can lock down three to four solid targets in a Heroic instance, or one (if un-CCable) to three (for e.g. Moroes) in a raid. There aren't many who would do Magister's Terrace Heroic with a Warrior tank and only a Hunter for crowd control, but we've done it routinely that way since its inception.

The topic was feedback on what would make Hunters better and/or more fun. It's not just about tanking, but the situations that I find most difficult to handle with this type of play generally involve melee-range threat. Traps rely on being able to position mobs, and the best way to get them where I want them is to have them hating me. Hunters can do very well making sure the right mobs are hitting (or not hitting) the right people, but where it collapses is when the mobs are close and we want them to (continue to) hit us (for even a few seconds) to save someone extra-squishy. Hence, that's where my feedback is mainly focused.

The gear concerns are because I don't really care about DPS; my groups value me for other things. Defensive bonuses would help keep me alive to do them, but the stat distributions that interest me are invariably found on plate or leather items.

I ain't askin' to take away anything from the DPS Hunters. I just would love to see a better-defined identity for Survival Hunters, and this is the one that I've found the most fun. I don't like that there is but one gear set for PvE Hunters, whereas most classes have two or even three.

-Myn

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Well if your guild dosnt care about your DPS in raids then they are idiots as well, sure if your gonna go to heroics spec whatever, but your guild is in Hyjil and I know as a raid leader never in a million years would i bring a "tanking surv hunter' with 14k health to a raid i have 9k without gimping my dps and as far as not letting a squishy preist die thats why hunters have traps

I think the problem is that you think Survival means you can or should be able to tank. It's not up to Blizzard to change mechanics that aren't being used as intended.

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Q u o t e:
There aren't many who would do Magister's Terrace Heroic with a Warrior tank and only a Hunter for crowd control, but we've done it routinely that way since its inception.

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Funny, I have done this several times on my hunter and quite a few more on my prot warrior. It's not exactly hard and it does not require a hunter that can tank or even one to have points in Survival. So I am not sure I understand why you are bringing it up as one of your points of why this is a good spec and why changes should be made.

I'm a raiding Survival hunter and I'm an old school 0/21/30 fan so I have nothing against the tree. However, hunters were not designed to tank. The tree, vaguely, is meant to help keep the hunter and others alive for short periods of time through abilities besides it's obvoius DPS improvement talents. It is not a tanking tree. If you want to play a tank go roll a class that can do it .

I would kill to see you tank Mag for 60 seconds without 10 people spam healing you non-stop. Just the standard healers a regular tank gets.

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Q u o t e:


I led a team that produced no less than fifteen Grand Marshals through skill, tactics, and good teamwork. Bash my playstyle all you want, but don't you dare question my right to hold this title. I worked darn hard to earn it.

-Myn

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LOL. BS.
If your playstyle was the same back then as it is now, you were carried by your team.

or you just afk'd in AV

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Q u o t e:


LOL. BS.
If your playstyle was the same back then as it is now, you were carried by your team.

or you just afk'd in AV

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In those days, AV matches were several days long (yes, there was actually a night shift). Most of my PvP days were spent barking orders from the hill by the Stable in AB, though there was plenty of WSG thrown in for good measure. Not all leadership takes the form of statistics (unless you want to count Wins and Losses).

-Myn

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Q u o t e:
Funny, I have done this several times on my hunter and quite a few more on my prot warrior. It's not exactly hard and it does not require a hunter that can tank or even one to have points in Survival. So I am not sure I understand why you are bringing it up as one of your points of why this is a good spec and why changes should be made.

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Point was that you need a Hunter with good situational awareness and a realization that the class is good for more than DPS to do it, or you'll get smoked. It was a refutation of the "Huntard" moniker, not any particular assertion that it was a Survival speciality (though being Survival IS handy for that kind of group).

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Q u o t e:
I would kill to see you tank Mag for 60 seconds without 10 people spam healing you non-stop. Just the standard healers a regular tank gets.

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Staying alive is the easy part, actually. The hard part is hanging on to him long enough for a tank to recover and build threat without some gonzo Warlock or Mage tearing him away. >8P

-Myn

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Q u o t e:


Staying alive is the easy part, actually. The hard part is hanging on to him long enough for a tank to recover and build threat without some gonzo Warlock or Mage tearing him away. >8P

-Myn

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screen shots or it didn't happen

/cry



thats all i have to say
thats how dumb this thread makes me feel