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Q u o t e:
I've never seen anyone explain why its so terrible for achievements with rewards to have random components, but its ok for mobs to have random drop rates.

Basically, anyone that thinks that the violet proto should not have any random components should also be campaigning for every piece of dropped loot (including both gear and things like mounts) to be on a token system instead, so you can be assured to get something after putting a certain amount of effort in.

50 Kael kills should buy you a phoenix and what not.

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Because you can kill the same mob throughout the year, where as the achivements for the festival have a limit time period. Imagine how much qq there will be if blizzard where to make each piece of Tier 10 from ICC only drop at certain months, so for example if you do not get the T10 chest piece this month, you have to wait 3-4 months before the loot cycle drop chest piece again.

time length to get something with RNG involve doesnt equal something you can do every week for years.
When will people understand that.

You dont see people complaining about the raptor mount from ZG because you have a chance every reset while as getting lets say a tooth pick that my main has needed since last year might never drop even if i trick or treat every hour on the hour for the remaining days.

Remove raptor mount and put in item X same principles.
ps wtb reigns of unrevialing (spelling?) to drop atleast once

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Q u o t e:


Because you can kill the same mob throughout the year, where as the achivements for the festival have a limit time period. Imagine how much qq there will be if blizzard where to make each piece of Tier 10 from ICC only drop at certain months, so for example if you do not get the T10 chest piece this month, you have to wait 3-4 months before the loot cycle drop chest piece again.

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Speaking of vanity mounts, some of them have such a low drop rate that even if you were to do them for the entire year, you still would be less likely to get it than most (probably all) of the random elements people complain about with these holiday achievements.

Its not a bad thing, in most cases, for the randomness to be compressed into a short period, rather than trying to farm something for a year and not getting it.

There is something to be said for missing a day of a holiday event being much more significant than missing a week in farming a mount, but in the end, the chance of not getting something during a holiday event is much less than the chance of missing some of the rarer mounts farming for an entire year.

For example, killing Baron every day for an entire year still leaves you with ~2.5% chance of not getting a mount.

Killing Kael'thas every week for a year leaves you with a greater than 30% chance of not seeing a mount. You are also going to have people to roll against when it does drop.

Would you rather have a 99% chance to get something, but you can only try one day a year, or a .000001% chance, but you can try every day.

The point being, the fact that one can be tried throughout the year and the other can't doesn't inherently make one better than the other. Things you can farm for all year aren't inherently more fair or easier to get than things with a time limit.

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Q u o t e:
Seriously - THIS IS THE SECOND DAY- the event itself is about TWO WEEKS long - stop complaining.

Give it time.

You'll get stuff eventually.

If it was the 29th, you might start complaining but unti lthen CHILL

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Wow, good argument! Except that it's not, and you're no better than the whiners you're criticizing.

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Q u o t e:


Speaking of vanity mounts, some of them have such a low drop rate that even if you were to do them for the entire year, you still would be less likely to get it than most (probably all) of the random elements people complain about with these holiday achievements.

Its not a bad thing, in most cases, for the randomness to be compressed into a short period, rather than trying to farm something for a year and not getting it.

There is something to be said for missing a day of a holiday event being much more significant than missing a week in farming a mount, but in the end, the chance of not getting something during a holiday event is much less than the chance of missing some of the rarer mounts farming for an entire year.

For example, killing Baron every day for an entire year still leaves you with ~2.5% chance of not getting a mount.

Killing Kael'thas every week for a year leaves you with a greater than 30% chance of not seeing a mount. You are also going to have people to roll against when it does drop.

Would you rather have a 99% chance to get something, but you can only try one day a year, or a .000001% chance, but you can try every day.

The point being, the fact that one can be tried throughout the year and the other can't doesn't inherently make one better than the other. Things you can farm for all year aren't inherently more fair or easier to get than things with a time limit.

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I'm glad you don't understand drop chance and probability.

Also glad you don't know the drop rates of the mounts.

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Q u o t e:
but the majority of at least the forum community, are not.

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Actually, the majority think it is just fine.

The only reason someone would log onto the forum to complain is if they are one of the minority that are extremely unlucky. Therefore, the vast majority of the posts you see will be negative. This is not a proper view.

For example, when I got toothpicks the FIRST bag of candy I opened, it didn't occur for me to log on the forum to start talking about toothpicks. The unlucky bastard who won the lottery of losers and has opened 300 bags without getting a toothpick, however, is probably going to get on the forum to complain.

If you feel you need to log on every single hour and risk progression at a job or lose sleep over this holiday event... it's time to quit WoW.

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Q u o t e:


I'm glad you don't understand drop chance and probability.

Also glad you don't know the drop rates of the mounts.

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Baron mount has a 1% drop chance. So a 99% chance of not dropping.

.99^365 *100% ~ 2.5% chance of no mounts within 365 kills

Wowhead has the ashes at a 1.6% drop rate.

Taking it to be 2% instead, .98^52*100% ~ 35% chance of no ashes within 52 kills.

I'm glad you like to make a fool of yourself.

These mounts are significantly more rare than any holiday achievement on the meta.

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Q u o t e:


1) I can guarantee you that I have done more in this game than you have.

2) I have completed every long quest chain in the game except the bang-a-gong quest.

3) My chances for completing this achievement, What a Long, Strange Trip It's Been, this year looks to be about 20%. I'm not happy.

4) I put up with PvP in battlegrounds, which I hate. I've tagged rabbit ears for hours. I've become a stalker outside horde heaven for hours.

I don't need to be lectured by a BE hunter about working at the game.

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Awe, I hurt a level 60 DK alts feelings. Feel free to post on your main. Not that I care if you have done more or not but I find is suitable that you are crying like a *%!#* over some RNG.

LOLBEHUNTER, it's old. I enjoy the choice I made though it seems you have not with yours since you didn't post on it.

/whine
i completed the event last year and now i cant track my candy buckets anymore
GG blizz! you ruined my event for me /whine

Where does the sense of entitlement come from?

"I ran this X many times, thus I DESERVE it!"

"I visited X NPC Y number of times and he still didn't give me Z item, it's unfair!"

For each of the Hallow's quests/activities, you get a reward. You're just pissed that it isn't the one you "need."

Come back and flame when you have an argument that isn't based on:
1. A completely misguided sense of entitlement.
2. Whining about RNG, which is still entitlement just delightfully combined with egotism.

If you can do that, convince me there's something "wrong" with achievements.

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Q u o t e:
I've never seen anyone explain why its so terrible for achievements with rewards to have random components, but its ok for mobs to have random drop rates.

Basically, anyone that thinks that the violet proto should not have any random components should also be campaigning for every piece of dropped loot (including both gear and things like mounts) to be on a token system instead, so you can be assured to get something after putting a certain amount of effort in.

50 Kael kills should buy you a phoenix and what not.

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The difference is the holiday RNG achievements are limited time only. They also change your playstyle, especially as you go longer with being unlucky.

Bosses are generally available at all times, so the drop, while random, is always there. Or at least the potential to get it is always there. Also, it's been implied that the holidays are supposed to be fun events. But RNG makes them not so much fun, but so much frustrating, especially as it nears the end. Don't get that loot from Faction Champions today that you wanted? Do it next week, then. And the next week, and the next week, etc. Oh, and in a couple months there'll be a new raid instance out with better loot, so you may just move on and aim for better loot from there. Don't get a toothpick drop from trick-or-treating today? Do it every hour that you can for the next 10 days, because after that you have to wait an entire year to try again. RNG holiday drops are just frustrating, considering how many achieves you have to do over the course of an entire year to do the complete Strange Trip achievement. There WILL be people who do all they can over an entire year and fail to get the total achievement due to RNG. Not due to not trying, not due to lack of skill, but due to bad RNG rolls. It may not be a HUGE number of people, but there will be some who fall into that category (missing just RNG achieves, not due to lack of trying). That's just plain stupid.

RNG achieves for other achiements (such as rare fish for Salty, etc) are frustrating, sure, but not nearly as much, since you can ALWAYS fish for those rare drops (Pinchy, etc). There's never a time when you say "damn, I didn't get it today, now I have to wait a whole year to try again!" Plus you just might get something useful other than the achieve drop (something you can either use or sell). HH? I don't personally consider the mount drop from him desirable (I just want the pet and the cloth helm - and not for the intrinsic value of either item, but because they are needed for Strange Trip), yet in 25ish attempts, 1 pet drop and 1 cloth helm drop, and a useless ring every single time. Oh and useless candy every time, too. And after the...2nd time...the fight is very unintersting. And never challenging. Groups leave there, generally, thinking, "that sucked", because like 90% of the time nothing useful drops (at least in my own experience).

I still don't see a fundamental difference between someone putting effort into a violet proto for an entire year and not getting it, and someone farming Baron/Kael for an entire year with nothing to show for it. And the chance of not getting a phoenix in an entire year is many, many times greater than missing one of the handful of random achievements in the meta. (if you 5 man Kael every week for 52 weeks, you have about a 21% chance of getting a phoenix assuming everyone with you also wants it)

Arguably, the people farming the mounts put MORE effort into it than the people going for a violet proto drake. When you go for a violet proto drake, there are large sections of the year where you don't have to do anything. To maximize chances at the drop mounts, you have to go as often as you can throughout the whole year.

It is still inconsistent to say that RNG components of the meta are inherently unfair but RNG mount drops are fine.

Inc logical statement so whiners please ignore:

Not everyone will get a holiday meta or a drake. It has been designed this way. If everyone was supposed to get it, all RNG would be removed and it would be in your mailbox after you pay for 12 consecutive months.

Carry on.

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Q u o t e:
I'll be back. /grr

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We'll be waiting. ;)

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Q u o t e:
Seriously - THIS IS THE SECOND DAY- the event itself is about TWO WEEKS long - stop complaining.

Give it time.

You'll get stuff eventually.

If it was the 29th, you might start complaining but unti lthen CHILL

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Probably because if you wait until the last day to justifiably complain about a year's worth of effort getting wasted not by your effort but because of an RNG generator it's too late for Blizzard to fix the problem until next year.

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Q u o t e:
Inc logical statement so whiners please ignore:

Not everyone will get a holiday meta or a drake. It has been designed this way. If everyone was supposed to get it, all RNG would be removed and it would be in your mailbox after you pay for 12 consecutive months.

Carry on.



We'll be waiting. ;)

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I don't have a problem with not getting the mount if it was a failure of effort on my own part. Not getting the mount simply due to an RNG generator is infuriating.

By the way, the RNG in this instance is compounded when doing trick or treating. You first have to beat the RNG to get the treat bag as opposed to being tricked. Then you have to beat it again for the pet. It's like being required to win the lottery twice in a row in order to collect your cash.

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Q u o t e:

There are already two big achievements that force players to possibly do things they would not normally do with Hallow's End. One being G.N.E.R.D. Rage and the other being Tricks or Treats of Azeroth. Those two alone match the time and tasks of other seaonal meta achievements.

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GNERD rage is completely doable by eating some GNERDS, then doing Wintergrasp. I would even say that achievement is completely trivialized by Wintergrasp >.>.

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Q u o t e:


*marks the 29th on the calendar*

I'll be back. /grr

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Really? Countless posts requesting the removal of RNG achievements from the meta using VALID arguments and THIS is the blue post we get?
I guess I'll just wait until the event is over before knowing if our requests will be answered.