World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Clickers V Keybinds

Rexgar

Illidan

200. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:29:42 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

So let's turn this back toward you...

Do you need to look at the radio when adjusting your stations, or do you just bumble through stations blindly? Do you need to look at your climate control while adjusting the heat/fan speed, or do you just keep blindly tinkering with them until it feels like the dials are in the correct spot?

How about when you get in a car you've never driven before? Do you automatically remember where every switch and knob in the car is and the fuction it performs, or do you need to look away to remember where the windshield wipers & headlights are when it starts to rain? Let me guess...you fumble with all the buttons until they come on.

Classic.

My radio has "macros" for my saved stations, my AC just kinda second nature as I turn the nobs. Really not hard to remember where they are. Your analogy is just as bad.

Formerly known as Shiftace.

Iolwut

Thunderhorn

201. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:29:47 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

but please don't claim that it's as fast as good keybinds.

Sounds like elitism to me.

My way is better, and there's nothing you can say or do to prove otherwise!

Soultaken

< dexterity >

Skullcrusher

202. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:30:07 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
Thank you for your in depth and concise opinion. I'm sure you have swayed many to your wise and powerful argument. ;)

Every single player at the Arena Tournament at Blizzcon keybinded every spell.

- Xjum, Level 80 Priest
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Skullcrusher&n=Xjum

Samelault

< Annihilation >

Sentinels

203. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:30:35 AM PDT

Actually, i used to be mouse user until i got a 30" monitor. Now the buttons are too far away (or i have to move the pointer so fast i am inacurate in my click), so i move to 90% keybind.

I still use the mouse on my laptop though, esp for pvp. Theres lots of reason to pick one over the other :)

"I'd compare BGs [...] to something more like a bar brawl. It's violent, there's no real sense of organization, and someone's going to be drunk, naked, and furious at the end." - Cytrode, Kirin Tor

Iolwut

Thunderhorn

204. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:30:49 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

My radio has "macros" for my saved stations, my AC just kinda second nature as I turn the nobs. Really not hard to remember where they are. Your analogy is just as bad.

I was thinking more about driving outside your local area, where your "macros" for your favorite local stations don't apply.

Rexgar

Illidan

205. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:31:31 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

Sounds like elitism to me.

My way is better, and there's nothing you can say or do to prove otherwise!

Because it is faster? You really are trying too hard now.

Formerly known as Shiftace.

Sprunt

Cho'gall

207. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:31:54 AM PDT

I use a Nostromo, and I click my highly situational spells/skills - because highly situational stuff never needs to be as fast as stuff I mash all the time. And on my nostromo I have 1 "oh sh*t" button for emergencies and it's the 1 button that's almost impossible to hit by accident.

Example: Judgment of whatever=nostromo, 30 minute blessing of whatever=click, bubble=oh sh*t

A true victory is to make your enemy see they were wrong to oppose you in the first place. To force them to acknowledge your greatness. - Gul Dukat

Naphomci

< Slane Baanrit >

Silver Hand

208. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:32:48 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
Ah, you cheat by using your legs. Try using 1 hand and nothing else between the gears and wheel.

Car analogies are great. You can make anything into a car analogy. :D

The point is, you don't have to look at the gear shift before you shift. You don't have to look at the foot pedals before you press. You shouldn't have to look at your keys when you type or use abilities. It's much better that way. Can you imagine having to look down whenever you press a foot pedal or change gears?

You remind me of my middle school typing teacher. The teacher ranted on and on about how it was impossible to get higher than 45 words per minute by using just two fingers and looking at the keyboard. I hated the traditional typing set up and to this day do no use it. He gave up on me once I passed 100 words per minute using two fingers, while looking between the keyboard and the screen about every third word. The style is going to work differently for different people. I now use a bizarre typing method that involve 7 fingers with the thumbs counted. Similarily, I use a method that is mostly clicking with some keybinding, and going to all keybinding would not be that much of a benefit. That 0.1 second someone metioned, while I might live, if it was by 0.1 seconds, odds are damn good I'll be dead in the next 0.1 seconds anyway.

Some should be common knowledge:
You lose a game. Your shoelace is loose. You do not loose a game.
Ridiculous- worthy of ridicule, so is rediculous worthy of red?

Rexgar

Illidan

209. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:32:52 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

I was thinking more about driving outside your local area, where your "macros" for your favorite local stations don't apply.

The Seek button is hard to forget right?

Formerly known as Shiftace.

Enum

< Prominence >

Dragonmaw

210. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:38:59 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

I was thinking more about driving outside your local area, where your "macros" for your favorite local stations don't apply.

I don't change macros in the middle of a fight. If I have to set up macros, I stand still somewhere while I enter them into the macro window. I sure hope you don't drive without your eyes on the road.

Orphane

< Fêar >

Bloodscalp

211. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:40:01 AM PDT

I have purge and windshear bound to mouse buttons. I have certain trinkets keybound...

but I play elemental, so turret spec is turret :D

Iolwut

Thunderhorn

212. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:40:24 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
You remind me of my middle school typing teacher. The teacher ranted on and on about how it was impossible to get higher than 45 words per minute by using just two fingers and looking at the keyboard. I hated the traditional typing set up and to this day do no use it. He gave up on me once I passed 100 words per minute using two fingers, while looking between the keyboard and the screen about every third word. The style is going to work differently for different people. I now use a bizarre typing method that involve 7 fingers with the thumbs counted. Similarily, I use a method that is mostly clicking with some keybinding, and going to all keybinding would not be that much of a benefit. That 0.1 second someone metioned, while I might live, if it was by 0.1 seconds, odds are damn good I'll be dead in the next 0.1 seconds anyway.

Actually I think typing methods is an even better analology.

I type around 100 WPM using 2-3 fingers in a "hunt and peck" method.

Yes, if I switched to a more traditional ASDF method, I might, sooner or later, learn to type faster. But my "hunt and peck" works just fine for me, it gets the job done, and I type faster than most non-professional ASDF typers.

Does that make me wrong?

Brethart

< Rush >

Dark Iron

213. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:40:47 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
People should play how they feel most comfortable. If someone is a faster clicker and it makes sense to them, then that's fine. If someone loves making macros and keybinds, that's fine too. Neither is better than the other and many people even combine the two depending on the circumstance. It's about playing within your comfort zone. That's not to say that complacency is good. Trying new things will help broaden playstyle and make it more clear as to whether one will fit you better than another. But lambasting others for a choice in how they play is never productive or constructive.

The only way to lift other players up is to give them the chance to learn without fear of being put down for their mistakes.

Lol a clicker will never have the skills to be in a top end raid guild. Keep lying to the public though, it's good for business.

Weiyaya

Emerald Dream

214. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:45:11 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

Sounds like elitism to me.

My way is better, and there's nothing you can say or do to prove otherwise!

Facts are facts. "Better" may be a point of debate depending on your priorities, but you can't really argue that keybinding & mouse-turning are not significantly "faster." If "faster" does not equal "better" to you, then your point is well taken. If you want to click & keyboard turn in a safe PvE environment, that's your business. Just don't try defending it in any PvP situation, where "faster" unequivocally equals "better."

Iolwut

Thunderhorn

215. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:46:23 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

Facts are facts. "Better" may be a point of debate depending on your priorities, but you can't really argue that keybinding & mouse-turning are not significantly "faster." If "faster" does not equal "better" to you, then your point is well taken. If you want to click & keyboard turn in a safe PvE environment, that's your business. Just don't try defending it in any PvP situation, where "faster" unequivocally equals "better."

/thread

Nethaera

Blizzard Poster

216. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:47:06 AM PDT

By the way, one being better than the other (in what I was referencing previously) has more to do with the individual player than an overall x is better than y. Some people have a harder time with using hotkeys and remembering them all. (As some have said in this thread.) They don't perform as well because they are fumbling for keys they don't feel comfortable with. Of course, that can be overcome with careful planning and practice. For others though, they don't care to change how they play and continue to do well with it. For them, clicking is better than fumbling for keys.

Most importantly- Playing shouldn't be stressful. It should be fun.

If you want to go with the pure X is better than Y, then you could prove that keybind is better provided you have two people of equal skill using one or the other in a perfectly even scenario. You'd also need to make sure they were using the exact same character with the exact same gear and abilities. Then you could measure the speed at which they handle an identical task and situation- At least, if it was a perfect scenario.

Nethaera's Status-
Danger- High Caffeine Content- Highly combustible with a sarcasm side affect. Do not tap on glass.

Community Team Member

Enum

< Prominence >

Dragonmaw

217. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:48:24 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
You remind me of my middle school typing teacher. The teacher ranted on and on about how it was impossible to get higher than 45 words per minute by using just two fingers and looking at the keyboard. I hated the traditional typing set up and to this day do no use it. He gave up on me once I passed 100 words per minute using two fingers, while looking between the keyboard and the screen about every third word. The style is going to work differently for different people. I now use a bizarre typing method that involve 7 fingers with the thumbs counted. Similarily, I use a method that is mostly clicking with some keybinding, and going to all keybinding would not be that much of a benefit. That 0.1 second someone metioned, while I might live, if it was by 0.1 seconds, odds are damn good I'll be dead in the next 0.1 seconds anyway.

If you're talking about keeping your hands on the home row, I don't do that either, but I've typed long enough that I have a memory of where the keys are so I don't really have to look.
I think in keeping with the clicking vs. keybind theme, try typing using an onscreen keyboard and clicking the keys instead of using a keyboard.

Asael

< Silent Symphony >

Ravenholdt

218. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:49:53 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

In terms of efficiency binding is FAR superior. There's even quite a few twitchy actions that are not possible as a clicker like the mage's shatter combo for example since your cursor must already be on the screen when you need to toggle the macro. For the sake of argument though I'd like to point out that heavy keybing is overkill too; if you misplace your hand position it's just as bad you shouldn't need more than 1,2,3,4,5,6,Q,E,F,X,MMB,M4,M5 and TAB and double these with shift and CTRL modifiers.

Some classes have to many situational abilities too that are not required to be binded. Shammies for instance just have too much totems so I just bind key totems that I use in combat and click lesser totems, buffs ,rez and certain consumables.

Clickers just can't jumpshot and kite properly too not to mention that most of them are constantly back pedaling. That statement is is an undeniable fact which pulverize to dust any attempt to justiify clicking. The reason clicking is bad has nothing to do with the speed at which you can click just FYI.

This is a great reply.

It gives a good reasons why it's more efficient to keybind and not click everything.

I would like to comment on part that I underlined. Sometimes it's easier to click a spell while in mid-air straffing while keeping your hands on your WASD so you land and pedal in desired direction because my hands can't reach # key without releasing movement.

e.g. my run, jump mouseturn, backlash-incinerate and then option-click drop portal as I land and bounce jump turn straff to LoS

It's a healthy combo of the two and makes you more efficient.

The Liver is Evil and must be Punished

Zaeldren

< Awry >

Cenarius

219. Re: Clickers V Keybinds 10/14/2009 11:51:06 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
If you're talking about keeping your hands on the home row, I don't do that either, but I've typed long enough that I have a memory of where the keys are so I don't really have to look.
I think in keeping with the clicking vs. keybind theme, try typing using an onscreen keyboard and clicking the keys instead of using a keyboard.

Stop making analogies. Yours are far worse than the normal flimsy ones.

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