World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable?

Acerbus

< Warlords of Bakersfi… >

Firetree

100. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:16:52 PM PDT

I think any player that has a decent understanding of their class will pull at least 1200-1500 freshly at 80. The only times I see a class with pitifully low dps is when they severely lack the fundamentals of their class. For example, I ran into a 600 dps warlock once, whose highest damage spell was curse of agony.

EDIT: Sentence wording fail.

[ Post edited by Acerbus ]

Yavana

Anetheron

102. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:21:30 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

2k DPS is low for heroics. With regular TOC and the tournament around, people should be pulling 2.5-3k at the very least, or they aren't investing the time in their character to gear and learn rotations. Aka, they are looking for a ride.

My rogue pulls 4-5k in H TOC, and he only has 1 raid drop - a Naxx 10 off-hand dagger.

link? I've not seen a single person pull more than 4.1K DPS in H ToC.

Ryaskybird

< Ninth Alliance >

Sentinels

103. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:23:49 PM PDT

Q u o t e:
you could do 0 dps, dps is easy to carry in heroics

that being said I just armory everybody before I invite, most of my groups people do 2.5k+ minimum.

This is a Wow urban myth. I've healed (on my healer, obviously) runs where there was one dps doing subpar damage. In one H VH run, there was a hunter doing less than 500 dps (I think he didn't have any bullets). The other two were doing 2.5k or higher. The hunter eventually left after we wiped and he was confronted about his extremely low dps, and was replaced by another competent dps'er. I could tell the difference--the fights were over quicker and I had less strain on me to keep everyone alive.

On the other hand, I've healed groups where the dps was doing 1.2-1.8k dps, and while it was more of a challenge to keep them up than a more geared group, we got through the instances fine.

Edited to add that dps in a regular instance is not the same as dps in a heroic.

[ Post edited by Ryaskybird ]

You better stay away from him, he'll rip your lungs out Jim.
Huh, I'd like to meet his tailor.

Awooo! Werewolves of Gilneas. Awooo!

Emerl

< Le Dynasty >

Cho'gall

104. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:24:56 PM PDT

Q u o t e:
link? I've not seen a single person pull more than 4.1K DPS in H ToC.

I can certainly do more than 4k1 dps in H TOC. Nevertheless, my druid in blue quest gear can only pull 1k2 dps.
Sue me.

Andonisus

< Coercion >

Lightning's Blade

105. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:25:55 PM PDT

I was doing almost 3k dps back at 70 single target on my warlock pre 3.0(yes I know raid buffs and ##*@ bla bla bla). People that can't pull 2k in a heroic where most of the damage done can be done through AoE makes me cry tears of crying. Grouping with randoms that actually pull more dps than me while i'm tanking makes me happy.

My hand is bind on forehead.

Samoo

< Dissonance >

Feathermoon

106. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:26:42 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

This is a Wow urban myth. I've healed (on my healer, obviously) runs where there was one dps doing subpar damage. In one H VH run, there was a hunter doing less than 500 dps (I think he didn't have any bullets). The other two were doing 2.5k or higher. The hunter eventually left after we wiped and he was confronted about his extremely low dps, and was replaced by another competent dps'er. I could tell the difference--the fights were over quicker and I had less strain on me to keep everyone alive.

On the other hand, I've healed groups where the dps was doing 1.2-1.8k dps, and while it was more of a challenge to keep them up than a more geared group, we got through the instances fine.

That's not a myth, I can three-man heroics with my DK tank, a paladin healer, and a boomkin from my guild all in only 10-man gear from Naxx/Uld/ToC + random badges in very reasonable times.

Heroics are a joke in this expansion.

< The Sundering >

Cenarius

108. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:27:45 PM PDT

2k dps in heroics is easily doable with a combat rogue the SAME DAY she gets to level 80, with the help of a few blues off the AH.

[ Post edited by Au ]

Ryaskybird

< Ninth Alliance >

Sentinels

109. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:28:19 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

That's not a myth, I can three-man heroics with my DK tank, a paladin healer, and a boomkin from my guild all in only 10-man gear from Naxx/Uld/ToC + random badges in very reasonable times.

Heroics are a joke in this expansion.

I'd love to see this. Screenshots?

You better stay away from him, he'll rip your lungs out Jim.
Huh, I'd like to meet his tailor.

Awooo! Werewolves of Gilneas. Awooo!

Zarhym

Blizzard Poster

110. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:29:13 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

I'm wondering, as a Blizzard employee that plays WoW, if while playing this game you've ever encountered people that trash talk you for not being up to their expectations? And if so, how do you feel about that?

I haven't really experienced that doing any group PvE content. As I've been learning group play with my death knight, it is pretty much all with guild mates. They know my experience with the game and understand that I'm learning how to run instances with a melee class. In fact, they're usually running me through for the upgrades.

I've been in plenty of pick-up groups before, but mainly on my warlock. He holds his own just fine... aside from the time I accidentally moved during Flame Wreath in Karazhan. That just ended up being extremely funny though, as it was the first time I ever literally wiped a raid. Most of my group knew me well and laughed pretty hard over it. And we're not talking about within the first five times or so of ever fighting Shade of Aran. This was probably my 30th time or something. ;p

Back at level 70 I used to run Battlegrounds ALL the time though on my warlock. The trash talking in that case was quite a bit different. It didn't usually involve a player remarking on my lack of skill, but rather me telling someone that would do nothing but complain and yell at everyone else for ruining his/her perfect PvP game play to either lead with sensible strategies, leave, or shut up.

It comes and it kills, cruising the earth
Attacking your towns as you watch from outside
And no one felt crashes in your hearts...

Taichikim

< LHC >

Steamwheedle Cartel

111. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:29:31 PM PDT

Most of the time I get annoyed when my dps can't pull about 1500. It's not asking a lot, but it is asking that they actually be trying.

A pirate I was meant to be! Trim the sails and roam the sea!
We'll surely avoid scurvy if we all eat an orange.

Kappar

< Common Sense >

Uther

112. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:35:03 PM PDT

Normal heroics you could practically do with a healer and a tank.

ToC heroic is a struggle if your DPS sucks.

That being said, 2k minimum is a bit high. I did heroic ToC as a fresh to 80, still using my leveling spec. I couldn't quite out DPS the tank if there was any AoE at all (and it was a warrior tank, not a pally). One of the other DPS was even worse than that, often struggling to break 1k, and even the third DPS that had good gear was not breaking 3k. We wiped once because the healer let the geared DPS die right at the end of the Black Knight's phase 2. Then I died right after, so there was just no DPS to finish it. Second try, the geared DPS died again at the end of phase two, but the healer kept the rest of us alive and we finished it.

Seeing as how phase 3 black knight is probably the most DPS intensive heroic fight right now, I'd say requiring 2k+ for heroics is mostly just being elitist.

Rule 35: That which does not kill me has made a tactical error.

Smashem

< Igglebound >

Stormreaver

113. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:38:33 PM PDT

Q u o t e:
What do you feel is a reasonable minimum dps for heroics?

Of all the DPS combined, I'd want to see an average of around 1400-1500. If one person's DPS is so low that it would jeopardize that, that person needs to be replaced because they are

1) Wearing level 60 gear
2) Not gemming/enchanting a single piece of gear
3) Wearing Holy gear as Ret
etc.

Zarhym

Blizzard Poster

114. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:40:46 PM PDT

Q u o t e:
That being said, 2k minimum is a bit high. I did heroic ToC as a fresh to 80, still using my leveling spec. I couldn't quite out DPS the tank if there was any AoE at all (and it was a warrior tank, not a pally).

Speaking of out-DPSing paladin tanks... My death knight still gets owned by our extremely well-geared paladin tank in Heroics (I'm still learning!). Anyway, we decided to stay in Loken's Lightning Nova, what with the outstanding gear and healing we had from the rest of the group and all. :p

The tank and I were the last ones standing when he was at 40% health. I died shortly after. We watched the tank solo him from 40% to death. It was neat.

It comes and it kills, cruising the earth
Attacking your towns as you watch from outside
And no one felt crashes in your hearts...

Taichikim

< LHC >

Steamwheedle Cartel

115. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:42:46 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

Speaking of out-DPSing paladin tanks... My death knight still gets owned by our extremely well-geared paladin tank in Heroics (I'm still learning!). Anyway, we decided to stay in Loken's Lightning Nova, what with the outstanding gear and healing we had from the rest of the group and all. :p

The tank and I were the last ones standing when he was at 40% health. I died shortly after. We watched the tank solo him from 40% to death. It was neat.

So... you're saying... Paladins are OP!? Blue post confirmed it!

ZomG!

A pirate I was meant to be! Trim the sails and roam the sea!
We'll surely avoid scurvy if we all eat an orange.

Elzexarid

Uldum

116. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:45:20 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

Speaking of out-DPSing paladin tanks... My death knight still gets owned by our extremely well-geared paladin tank in Heroics (I'm still learning!). Anyway, we decided to stay in Loken's Lightning Nova, what with the outstanding gear and healing we had from the rest of the group and all. :p

The tank and I were the last ones standing when he was at 40% health. I died shortly after. We watched the tank solo him from 40% to death. It was neat.

That's balanced, of course.

Pzâr

< Conceit >

Frostmourne

117. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:47:39 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

Speaking of out-DPSing paladin tanks... My death knight still gets owned by our extremely well-geared paladin tank in Heroics (I'm still learning!). Anyway, we decided to stay in Loken's Lightning Nova, what with the outstanding gear and healing we had from the rest of the group and all. :p

The tank and I were the last ones standing when he was at 40% health. I died shortly after. We watched the tank solo him from 40% to death. It was neat.

Funny thing with loken, as a priest healer, it is far easier to duo it than take a group. (Still easy with a group).

Also, on the stay in strat, it's always funny to watch dps go "omg I got hurt!" and run away.

Kappar

< Common Sense >

Uther

118. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:48:26 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

Speaking of out-DPSing paladin tanks... My death knight still gets owned by our extremely well-geared paladin tank in Heroics (I'm still learning!). Anyway, we decided to stay in Loken's Lightning Nova, what with the outstanding gear and healing we had from the rest of the group and all. :p

The tank and I were the last ones standing when he was at 40% health. I died shortly after. We watched the tank solo him from 40% to death. It was neat.

On that first run where all the DPS died, the healer went down eventually too, and the tank got the black knight down to the single digit percentages all by himself by blowing all his cooldowns.

I have no doubt at all that he would have killed him with ease if he had been a pally.

Rule 35: That which does not kill me has made a tactical error.

Khadaras

Khaz'goroth

119. Re: 2k minimum dps for heroics = reasonable? 10/05/2009 04:51:22 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

On that first run where all the DPS died, the healer went down eventually too, and the tank got the black knight down to the single digit percentages all by himself by blowing all his cooldowns.

I have no doubt at all that he would have killed him with ease if he had been a pally.

I did that the other day on my pally, and got him easily. After the dps and healer died, I bubbled. Let my health drop a bit before hitting myself with LoH. Ardent Defender ever procced at one point when he was almost dead.

Yeah. Not OP. *cough*

EDIT - Our dps was really low. I soloed him from about 20%.

[ Post edited by Khadaras ]

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