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Q u o t e:
Chain Heal jump is 8 yards in 3.1 and 10 yards in 3.2.

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Live
http://www.noobflicks.com/watch/6896/10_yard_ch_range_on_live_31

PTR
http://www.noobflicks.com/watch/7016/ptr_chain_heal_etc



So basically, the fix you wanted to implement to help resto shamans has already been in the game. How many fixes didn't work in this game? How many had the chance to foresee the fix didn't work through extensive live testing? Well, you already have your results. Maybe it is time you chose other avenues for us since this one has shown to be ineffective on live. Also, it looks like you have more to work on than your shaman coding...





bonus points for naming the 90's metal band playing in the second video.

Perhaps they can just add 2yds to the 10yds? (or better yet...2.5 yds, to make a 25% increase as before).

The jump distance does need to be increased, per the theorycrafting posts recently.

It should be 15, not 10. CoH and WG are both 15 yard RADIUS from the target, meaning theu covers a 30 yard diameter circle. Can't chain heal at least be half?

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Q u o t e:
So basically, the fix you wanted to implement to help resto shamans has already been in the game. How many fixes didn't work in this game? How many had the chance to foresee the fix didn't work through extensive live testing? Well, you already have your results. Maybe it is time you chose other avenues for us since this one has shown to be ineffective on live. Also, it looks like you have more to work on than your shaman coding...

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You do know that the PTR isn't over, right? Did you try posting on the PTR forums instead of coming here and whine about broken promises? Do you know for sure they won't add the 2 yards in an incoming build? Do you know that Restoration Shaman is not the only spec in the game they are working on, for this patch? Do you know that they currently have a sh!t ton of bugs at this moment that needs more attention?

Please, instead of crying, go the PTR and post a bug report, and see how that goes.

If this is correct, this really needs to be addressed.

Great detective work. I hope you get it increased to 15 yards.

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Q u o t e:
Great detective work. I hope you get it increased to 15 yards.

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I would rather our other healing spells got some love, to be honest :(

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Q u o t e:

Live
http://www.noobflicks.com/watch/6896/10_yard_ch_range_on_live_31

PTR
http://www.noobflicks.com/watch/7016/ptr_chain_heal_etc

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Good video and thanks for the time you put into this.

I did notice one thing though.

It is my understanding that DBM range checker is based off from your own spells/attacks because the game doesn't have the "range" system included in the API. If you look at it closely, the 10 yards checker for the hunter looks ever so slightly bigger than the 10 yards checker for your Shaman. I believe that stems from the hunter actually having 10 yard range spells such as Flare, whereas the Shaman has none.

I might be wrong, and it might just be camera zoom or angles that's fooling me. However, it might be worthwhile to put a hunter and shaman side by side for this, and check 10 yards with the Flare spell itself instead of using the Range Checker for anything at all. It just removes any sort of addon mistake from the equation and adds to the validity of the CH jump range checking.

Youtube imo

Good testing.

And people are right, it should be 15 yards. So many fights require (or at least encourage) standing 10 yards apart, to have CH only maybe chain through those players if they're standing perfectly is a pain in the ass.

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Q u o t e:
You do know that the PTR isn't over, right? Did you try posting on the PTR forums instead of coming here and whine about broken promises? Do you know for sure they won't add the 2 yards in an incoming build? Do you know that Restoration Shaman is not the only spec in the game they are working on, for this patch? Do you know that they currently have a sh!t ton of bugs at this moment that needs more attention?

Please, instead of crying, go the PTR and post a bug report, and see how that goes.

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man, you so smart! too bad you missed the entire point.

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Q u o t e:
D.A.D.

Good song.

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You win!

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Q u o t e:
I would rather our other healing spells got some love, to be honest :(

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That is the point of this. GC said CH was 8 on live and 10 on PTR. CH is already 10 on live and it has not helped. We have shown it to be ineffective thus they need to find another fix hopefuly by looking at others spells such as riptide. Increaseing the jump range to 12 yards will help slightly, but it really does not compete with druids and priests AoE.

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Q u o t e:
It is my understanding that DBM range checker is based off from your own spells/attacks because the game doesn't have the "range" system included in the API. If you look at it closely, the 10 yards checker for the hunter looks ever so slightly bigger than the 10 yards checker for your Shaman. I believe that stems from the hunter actually having 10 yard range spells such as Flare, whereas the Shaman has none.

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The flare ten yard radius is not an active spell meaning it is checking for range. It is a targetable AoE spell. I believe DBM is based off of UI duel range so it would be universal for all classes.

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Q u o t e:

The flare ten yard radius is not an active spell meaning it is checking for range. It is a targetable AoE spell. I believe DBM is based off of UI duel range so it would be universal for all classes.

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As I said, I might be wrong and I might be fooled by camera angles/zoom, but I still wanna make sure.

I plan to recruit a hunter friend sometime this week and go check this without any addons. It shouldn't be too hard. A lock and a hunter, dueled, lock damages hunter and life taps. Stands at the edge of his Flare. I CH either one and see if it jumps across.

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Q u o t e:


As I said, I might be wrong and I might be fooled by camera angles/zoom, but I still wanna make sure.

I plan to recruit a hunter friend sometime this week and go check this without any addons. It shouldn't be too hard. A lock and a hunter, dueled, lock damages hunter and life taps. Stands at the edge of his Flare. I CH either one and see if it jumps across.

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A reason for the angles is Hieratic and I were talking in vent while doing this and he said something about the hit boxes. So I chugged a few Pygmy oil and was the smallest hitbox available. That is probably why the range looks different due to the camera angles.

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Q u o t e:


As I said, I might be wrong and I might be fooled by camera angles/zoom, but I still wanna make sure.

I plan to recruit a hunter friend sometime this week and go check this without any addons. It shouldn't be too hard. A lock and a hunter, dueled, lock damages hunter and life taps. Stands at the edge of his Flare. I CH either one and see if it jumps across.

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I suggest 2 locks, same race and gender, and instead of something like the flare use environmental landmarks like a floor texture. Do the exact same test in the exact same place on live and ptr.

Testing for a simple thing, is the jump distance higher on PTR than on live. If it's not, no range increase has happened. Determining if there is a range change is more important that trying to reverse engineer the range calculation used for different spells.

That's my suggestion. I am going to attempt do this over the weekend as well.

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Q u o t e:


As I said, I might be wrong and I might be fooled by camera angles/zoom, but I still wanna make sure.

I plan to recruit a hunter friend sometime this week and go check this without any addons. It shouldn't be too hard. A lock and a hunter, dueled, lock damages hunter and life taps. Stands at the edge of his Flare. I CH either one and see if it jumps across.

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Checking is a good thing, the problem is a lot of people have said it is 10 yards on live. Blizzard has made mistakes time and again in knowing what their own game does so it would not surprise me if blizzard is wrong again. What I really do not understand is if all the other AOE heals are 15 yards then why the heck is chain heal the exception. It makes no since.

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Q u o t e:


Checking is a good thing, the problem is a lot of people have said it is 10 yards on live. Blizzard has made mistakes time and again in knowing what their own game does so it would not surprise me if blizzard is wrong again. What I really do not understand is if all the other AOE heals are 15 yards then why the heck is chain heal the exception. It makes no since.

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It actually does make a little sense when you consider the linear healing distance of Chain heal vs those other spells.

The base range of healing spells is 40 yards. So you can target a person for CH, CoH, WG etc who is 40 yards from where you stand. For WG and CoH, anyone within a 15 yard radius of the primary target can receive healing from the spell.

That means that if you have the following linear positioning.
Healer---40 yards-->Healer target --15 yards--> Person eligible to receive smart heal
You have 40 + 15 = 55 linear yards of distance from the Healer to a smart healed target.

Now look at the same scenario with glyphed Chain Heal using 10 yards jumps.
Healer--40 yards-->Healer target--10 yards-->First jump target--10 yards-->Second jump target--10 Yards-->Third jump target
You have 40 + 10 +10 +10 = 70 linear yards of healing distance. Healing a person 70 yards away from you.

Chain heal with 15 yard jumps.
Healer--40 yards-->Healer target--15 yards-->First jump target--15 yards-->Second jump target--15 Yards-->Third jump target
You have 40 + 15 +15 +15 = 85 linear yards of healing distance.

Prayer of healing is currently the only spell that matches a 10 yard jump range Chain Heal for linear distance. Prayer of heaing however is not a smart heal and is party bound to make up for its large range. Chain Heal's range is countered by the jump penalty each successive heal receives and by the smaller number of targets the spell can heal compared to other raid and multi target healing spells.

I have stated before that I think this linear range issue is the primary reason blizzard doesn't want to increase the jump distance. To fix it you would need to recode the spell to act similar to WG and CoH, require all jump targets to be within 15 or 20 yards of the primary target of the spell (giving the spell a max of 60 yards of linear distance, which is a linear range nerf even if the jump range really is 8 yards currently) and allowing the jumps to cover a much more manageable area than they currently are capable of doing.

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Q u o t e:


It actually does make a little sense when you consider the linear healing distance of Chain heal vs those other spells.

The base range of healing spells is 40 yards. So you can target a person for CH, CoH, WG etc who is 40 yards from where you stand. For WG and CoH, anyone within a 15 yard radius of the primary target can receive healing from the spell.

That means that if you have the following linear positioning.
Healer---40 yards-->Healer target --15 yards--> Person eligible to receive smart heal
You have 40 + 15 = 55 linear yards of distance from the Healer to a smart healed target.

Now look at the same scenario with glyphed Chain Heal using 10 yards jumps.
Healer--40 yards-->Healer target--10 yards-->First jump target--10 yards-->Second jump target--10 Yards-->Third jump target
You have 40 + 10 +10 +10 = 70 linear yards of healing distance. Healing a person 70 yards away from you.

Chain heal with 15 yard jumps.
Healer--40 yards-->Healer target--15 yards-->First jump target--15 yards-->Second jump target--15 Yards-->Third jump target
You have 40 + 15 +15 +15 = 85 linear yards of healing distance.

Prayer of healing is currently the only spell that matches a 10 yard jump range Chain Heal for linear distance. Prayer of heaing however is not a smart heal and is party bound to make up for its large range. Chain Heal's range is countered by the jump penalty each successive heal receives and by the smaller number of targets the spell can heal compared to other raid and multi target healing spells.

I have stated before that I think this linear range issue is the primary reason blizzard doesn't want to increase the jump distance. To fix it you would need to recode the spell to act similar to WG and CoH, require all jump targets to be within 15 or 20 yards of the primary target of the spell (giving the spell a max of 60 yards of linear distance, which is a linear range nerf even if the jump range really is 8 yards currently) and allowing the jumps to cover a much more manageable area than they currently are capable of doing.

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My only question of this is why does anyone care? In PVP noone uses CH (except maybe AV occaasionoally). In PVE what possible advantage would you get. I cant think of a SINGLE time you could reliably use the jumps to get max range. Sure on occasion I will bounce a CH around a corner (sunwell trash was a good example of this) , but thats rare and NOT very reliable.

Im not saying it should be any particular length, but the linear jump length should be the last thing they use as a reason not to iincrease the jump length.

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Q u o t e:


Prayer of healing is currently the only spell that matches a 10 yard jump range Chain Heal for linear distance. .

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Prayer of Mending has a 20 yd jump range from each person that it heals. Its also why PoM is so awesome in Ulduar since alot of the damage taken is periodic enough to make it basically jump 5 times and allows it to heal for its full amount.

So technically it has a larger jump range then enough CH.

It's hard to test the difference between 8 and 10 yards because none of the range mods are actually 100% accurate. Even using landmarks on the floor leaves you guessing at that small of a range difference. When typhoon's knockback got increased, I had a hard time really testing a 5 yard increase... because it's just hard to tell small distance increases on live vs. ptr

Sorry, but... small is just small. It's not going to look like a meaningful difference in your videos even if it is working right.