---

Q u o t e:
A question about Vampiric Embrace:

would it be too overpowered if it were an AoE spell?

What if, say, it returns x% damage as health for the primary target, and x%-y(or y%) for each target in a 10-yard circle?

That way, in a 1v1 PvP situation, it would be the same, but for a PvE or 2v2/5v5/world PvP environment, it would be better against multiple mobs?

Obviously the apparently (I don't see it much) overpowered-ness of Mind Sear would have to be brought down, but I would like this better.

Hell, even make it that the flat Vampiric Embrace value is simply divided among the number of targets you hit.

I just like seeing the dozens of little green numbers floating around my screen.

=P

---

I'd rather it be an aura than an AE cast effect. I mean, blood Death Knights have this, no? It might be weaker, but they're still moving in on our turf.

If a single spell on it's own is giving pve and pvp problems, it may be wise to look for a replacement.

---

Q u o t e:


I understand how the ability works and it is disappointing that in three pages of answers, this is the one the community chose to zero in on. Well played.

If I had not been trying to answer so many questions quickly, I would have typed more clearly. I would have said: We have had a lot of balance problems with Mind Control over the years in PvE. Players will take control of a creature and suddenly gain abilities which are quite powerful, especially when used against targets for which they weren't designed (the other mobs). To counter this we have had to make many creatures immune or otherwise limit the spell. (We've had some of the same balance issues with Spell Steal). Therefore, we don't think we have a lot of room to buff MC in PvP without making it too good in PvE. You may not like that answer if you are focused on PvP, but I can promise you many PvE players get upset when PvP balance ends up nerfing their class. We have to care about both sides of the game.

To those players focused on PvE, I'm sorry if you don't find the need to crowd control much in 5-player dungeons. In BC content like say Shadow Labs or classic content like LBRS, Mind Control was amazing to the point of trivializing some of the large pulls.

To those players who said the question was on PvP so it was inappropriate to talk about PvE: tough. We have to balance with both sides of the game in mind. It was a narrow question focused on how to issue movement commands to the target IIRC, and I figured more players would be interested in a broader answer on if we considered the spell sufficient at doing its job.

I will try to be proofread my writing more in the future with an eye towards clarity, but of course I just took several paragraphs to answer a relatively simple question that I could have spent answering other questions. That's the trade off. Think about that next time before you launch a half-dozen "gotcha!" threads. :)

---

More like "You've activated my TRAP CARD" threads.

It is obvious to me why most of you are not game designers by trade.

GC,

You need to go to bed and get ready for 4th of July 4 day weekend! Trust me, you made a lot of people satisfied with knowledge that you care. We might hunger for more power, but who doesn't? Please, go relax and enjoy the holidays, captain.

I honestly don't know what's wrong with you guys.

GC finally gives shadow priests some answers and all you can say is:

LOL MC OMFG U SO DUMB GC OMG

While it's actually clear he understands how the spell works.

---

Q u o t e:
I honestly don't know what's wrong with you guys.

GC finally gives shadow priests some answers and all you can say is:

LOL MC OMFG U SO DUMB GC OMG

While it's actually clear he understands how the spell works.

---

I am happy to believe that the people who say these sorts of things are a very minority. Just a very vocal minority.

I understand some people's reactions, cause when changes occurred in the past, making a spell or ability seem "omg this is crap now", it actually ended up being not that bad or even decent/good when I tried it myself.

First reaction would be to vent anger, then to think logic.

It is truly a pity that modern society chooses to go in this direction.

Also, I like the idea of an Aura.

With Dispersion... would it be too overpowered if, in mist form (for a lack of a better word), you became invisible to other players? Or dropped people's target momentarily, so that you would have to re-target them or use AoEs? That would add a usefulness for PvP.

I still like it in PvE, regardless of the silence effect. What if the mist form were a larger circle, and it provided mana-regen to anyone inside the mist? Do that, and make the mana-Hymn uncastable as a Shadow spec (would require a talent in Holy/Disc then, I guess), if people are concerned that Shadow ends up having too much mana-regen. I think it would work better.

Another idea would be, if you have Vampiric Embrace and/or Vampiric Touch on a target, it heals/mana charges people in the mist/nearby with health and mana. That would make it nicer, and that would mean you are still contributing in some way while silenced.

Edit: er, I didn't mean the poster of this quote, I meant the people they were talking about. Sorry for the wierd way I used your quote! T.T

Thank you for at least stopping by again GC. Even though none of the concerns I listed were mentioned by you, I'm sure it was because you ended up being focused on the plethora of people avalanching you regarding MC's mechanics, etc. Hopefully some of the concerns I, and others tried to intelligently post (and I'm not exactly known for being level-headed recently!) did make it through to you and the other devs.

Something tells me it's been a whole week full of Mondays for you this time around. Either that or it's Asshat Players week and somehow I ended up on the good side of the coin for a change. Scary, huh? :)

How the hell can you not moan about the gc not knowing a damn thing? "Thank you gc, Im so happy you think shadow priests are fine in pvp and pve, VE is overpowered, how didnt I see that!" These are game developers, they are supposed to answer us, you are paying them money every month to just read some blue text telling you that your class is fine?

Please, lets get pissed and start a !!#% storm. 15% passive speed boost, some cc immunity tacked on Fade, VT on par with UA, VE actually bieng useful, no cd on DP, fix phorror for gods sake- you gave us a cc that sucks ass for what reason? Its like showing me a pair of tits behind a glass wall

Goddamnit its not hard, and it woudnt make us overpowered. It would make us on par.


Edit: Forgot, FIX DISPERSION A SELF CC IS CRAP MAKE IT HEAL US TOO ATLEAST KTHX BAI. And give us MOAR SINGLE TARGET DPS YOU IMBECILE

---

Q u o t e:
How the hell can you not moan about the gc not knowing a damn thing? "Thank you gc, Im so happy you think shadow priests are fine in pvp and pve, VE is overpowered, how didnt I see that!" These are game developers, they are supposed to answer us, you are paying them money every month to just read some blue text telling you that your class is fine?

Please, lets get pissed and start a !!#% storm. 15% passive speed boost, some cc immunity tacked on Fade, VT on par with UA, VE actually bieng useful, no cd on DP, fix phorror for gods sake- you gave us a cc that sucks ass for what reason? Its like showing me a pair of tits behind a glass wall

Goddamnit its not hard, and it woudnt make us overpowered. It would make us on par.


Edit: Forgot, FIX DISPERSION A SELF CC IS CRAP MAKE IT HEAL US TOO ATLEAST KTHX BAI. And give us MOAR SINGLE TARGET DPS YOU IMBECILE

---

I know I'm not the most level headed guy out there and I can get heated sometimes....but I think my IQ actually dropped 50 points just by reading this.

---

Q u o t e:


I understand how the ability works and it is disappointing that in three pages of answers, this is the one the community chose to zero in on. Well played.

---

"The Community" (of Shadow Priests) did not choose to zero in on that answer. The trolls of our class chose to zero in on that answer. "The Community" isn't going to respond when people choose to behave that way, only the people you have been afraid to encourage will continue responding. It's always going to be that way. As one of the Shadow Priest masses, I am sorry for that, and can only say that I hope you can ignore those who will always disagree regardless, and know those of us who were honestly frustrated with (what we felt) was zero communication are happy with you addressing us with one post, let alone the three or four clarifications you have posted. (Not to say there aren't a couple of points I disagree with: Dispersion, gonna take it out of my spec, won't affect anything.)

I digress, at the end of the day please know that a few rabble rousers (SIC?) do not represent our "community" and please continue to attempt to have a dialogue with all classes and specs, when appropriate and possible.

Thank you.

EDIT for stupid use of quotation marks. And for clarification of a ubiquitous statement.

hes a lot angry but i got to say i think i agree with most of his points....

We are not mad at the GC about his MC thing i dont believe, I feel that most ppl are just frustrated caus of all the flat out no's in his regardes without any explenation or alternative you cant crush a persons dream and not give them a new one without expecting to become their most hated advisary.

So to elaborate on the crushed dreams at least mine; dispersion doesnt get the job done in pvp "minor stealth for 6 secs wouldnt be too OP" seeing as how long the CD is... But as is its lack luster for a 51 point talent hell id rather have it increase my shadow fiends dmg from 1k's-2.5k-3k least that would let me pressure ppl a lil more >.> but dispersion does nothing. Its not an escape mechanic since if the tards know how to follow then really there is no escaping!

As for our pve dmg i would like to see more synergy with our stat scaleing if not through haste then through another means perhaps crit or something usefull. Its not nice to be stuck out in the rain with no haste scaleing and limited scaleing in other stats besides spell power which is all around.

What else, oh yeah! I would love it if i could actually survive gadget gaurds like Deathknights do.... *cough cough VE buff for spriest only?* doesnt have to change anyone health gain just getting such lil hp back is sad. =*( ** EDITED** incase you cant read between the lines here im also talkin bout bg surv buff and stuff not nice to have to drop out of shadow form to get ur spell cast knocked back a bit and die .5sec from cast on a flash heal that would have eaten more mana then it was worth. I would much rather to be a stay in shadow most the time and if u absolutely get the golden moment drop heal and reaply but for the most part get ur heals from staying out of range and ve would be nice. (so much for between the lines.) =/

Also we lost a lot of utility in wotlk so this is why so many ppl are asking for a buff to single target dps, if we dont bring anything to the table shouldnt we at least be able to compete with the other ppl around us?

*edited to say* ty for at least the recognition, the good priests will discuss your ideas in more threads and hopefully wind up creating better questions in time for our Q & A official.

PS. i dont side with the gm or the trolls i side with the class and the class as a whole whats good for spriests is good for me so long as it doesnt destroy what i love which is competition.

Here's a suggestion to help fade a smidgeon (note: smidgeon not game breaking overhaul):

Add to the talent Veiled Shadows (formerly Improved Fade) a dodge increase while fade is up. Make it act like Rogue's Evasion. This will greatly lower chances of re application of snares and make us a more "tank" cloth caster like we are.

---

Q u o t e:
Here's a suggestion to help fade a smidgeon (note: smidgeon not game breaking overhaul):

Add to the talent Veiled Shadows (formerly Improved Fade) a dodge increase while fade is up. Make it act like Rogue's Evasion. This will greatly lower chances of re application of snares and make us a more "tank" cloth caster like we are.

---

Forgot to mention this earlier when I saw it. I am going to have to try your approach to Mind Control. I think you're on to something.

---

Q u o t e:
Here's a suggestion to help fade a smidgeon (note: smidgeon not game breaking overhaul):

Add to the talent Veiled Shadows (formerly Improved Fade) a dodge increase while fade is up. Make it act like Rogue's Evasion. This will greatly lower chances of re application of snares and make us a more "tank" cloth caster like we are.

---

This would have to have a semi high dodge rate tho since we dont naturally stack dodge and would make us have to manage a semi short cooldown in order to survive, i like it. now i will have a reason to fade when fighting rogues above the 1.5k bracket since by now all the ones i fight never get off me.

*fear* trink .5sec later caus they knew i would
*disperse* /sit and let runic power rage or focus build up

BTW i use disperse as a purely offensive ability particuarly against rogues! =O

*trink stun* fear & dot fast, shadow fiend ^_~
*disperse* they now are beating on me cant cos and vanish caus of dots & my sfiend so either they pop cos or die.

PLEASE COMMENT ON THIS!

~~

Since you want Dispersion to be a defensive ability, lets make it actually full defensive then. I'm talking about all out defensive. Not just some stupid shadow ball that gets humped by melee and killed after dispersion is over.

Dispersion
addtional effect: Drains 50% of enemy targets hp over 6 secs, healing you for the same amount.

This is to get *!*# off us, so we can actually escaped and not be stunned, resnared and dps'd while dispersed. Force the opponents to move away and create distance lest they heal us up close to full hp.

I'm playing to that energy drain mechanic. Its not the same as restoring 60% hp old Dispersion but its close. We dont get the heal if no enemies are around us.

(ps. i was the one who started the "cooldown removal of DP, but only on one target" movement)