Anyone know if blizzard has stated that their current design philosophy does not apply to healers?

You go on tanking and dps forums and he's constantly talking about balance and making sure that outside of unique buffs everyone is as close to equal as possible.

Then he comes here and goes on about homogenization this and different types of healers that.

I think their design philosophy is wonderful, it makes all the tanks and damage dealers work in harmony while still being effectively unique and fun to bring and play. Is blizzard applying this to Healers or are we a special case?

I'm not complaining or anything I just want some clarification.

i have no idea why we gotta be the same every class was once kool i once thought druids were awesome i hit lvl 70 to find out we are not even close to the best and all blizz seems to care about is dps and tanking being unique

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Q u o t e:
i have no idea why we gotta be the same every class was once kool i once thought druids were awesome i hit lvl 70 to find out we are not even close to the best and all blizz seems to care about is dps and tanking being unique

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This must be some kind of joke, druids are, by far and away, the best healers in the game currently.

Anyways I was saying that every dps/tank can do the same thing but in different ways. This is the homogenization blizzard has done to those specs, but so far I don't see that applying to healers.

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Q u o t e:
This must be some kind of joke, druids are, by far and away, the best healers in the game currently.

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agreed.

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Q u o t e:
Anyways I was saying that every dps/tank can do the same thing but in different ways. This is the homogenization blizzard has done to those specs, but so far I don't see that applying to healers.

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There is a distinct difference between healing and tanking / dps in raid encounters.

DPS' role is to pump out damage & watch threat. that's it.

Tanks are required to take it in the face & pump out enough treat to keep the dps alive. That's it.

Healers have ~2 roles in a raid environment. Tank healing & raid healing (mana management dependent on class). Having classes specialize in 1 or in some cases two is the dilemma. There seems to be a whole lot of "I want that" on the healing forums & that will always be the case as there most certainly never be parity as long as they have this distinction.

Healing is more about teamwork than any other role in a raid environment. Without each other, we cannot succeed. Given Blizzard's current healing design, I would suggest that you think about leveling a different class if you are unhappy with your class' current healing design.

Additionally, it's clearer by the day that healing is looked down upon in PVP so giving all healing classes potent AOE heals & potent/efficient single target heals just isn't something that is going to happen without some really hefty nerfs to us all.

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There is a distinct difference between healing and tanking / dps in raid encounters.

DPS' role is to pump out damage & watch threat. that's it.

Tanks are required to take it in the face & pump out enough treat to keep the dps alive. That's it.

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Understandable.

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Q u o t e:
Healers have ~2 roles in a raid environment. Tank healing & raid healing (mana management dependent on class). Having classes specialize in 1 or in some cases two is the dilemma. There seems to be a whole lot of "I want that" on the healing forums & that will always be the case as there most certainly never be parity as long as they have this distinction.

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But then why did druids get nourish? Why are they pushing tank healing for shamans now? I don't get this even though I clearly understand what you're saying.

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Q u o t e:
Healing is more about teamwork than any other role in a raid environment. Without each other, we cannot succeed. Given Blizzard's current healing design, I would suggest that you think about leveling a different class if you are unhappy with your class' current healing design.

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I'm already in the middle of leveling 2 other healer class actually. I just don't think it's fair that this is the decision they're leaving me with when no other role in the game is put under these conditions.

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Q u o t e:
Additionally, it's clearer by the day that healing is looked down upon in PVP so giving all healing classes potent AOE heals & potent/efficient single target heals just isn't something that is going to happen without some really hefty nerfs to us all.

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I think the resil change is actually an indirect buff to healing (to the point where it may seem op for some healing specs, but unless blizzard makes a 180 degree turn with the way they design raid encounters I don't think they could possibly nerf the classes that are deemed "OP" by the pvp community).

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But then why did druids get nourish? Why are they pushing tank healing for shamans now? I don't get this even though I clearly understand what you're saying.

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Disclaimer: I do not play a Druid or a Shaman, so I may be very wrong.

Druids have to specifically spec & gem/glyph to make Nourish all that it can be if I am not mistaken (which would drastically reduce their raid healing power). I think of it like the Disc / Holy Priest scenario except they don't have to drop throughput talents like Disc Priests do. You aren't going to get any argument from me on the current state of Druids, as they appear to be on the verge of near god-mode for some reason or another.

As for Shaman, currently they are in rough shape. I don't really know what the 'vision' is for the class, but they appear to be trying to push them more into the CH role that defined them in BT / Sunwell.

I don't advocate nerfs, but it's fairly obvious that some are pulling away & others are (or will be) falling behind. Both Paladins & Disc Priests are both taking some direct nerfs next patch so i strongly suspect that you will see more Druids move over into a tank healing role. Unfortunately, this may lead to a few Holy Paladins get squeezed out of their current spots because they do not have the healing flexibility that all other classes posses.

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I'm already in the middle of leveling 2 other healer class actually. I just don't think it's fair that this is the decision they're leaving me with when no other role in the game is put under these conditions.

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I think this is a shame that you feel obligated to do so, but understandable. The amount of time investment required to do this is more than it should be.

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I think the resil change is actually an indirect buff to healing (to the point where it may seem op for some healing specs, but unless blizzard makes a 180 degree turn with the way they design raid encounters I don't think they could possibly nerf the classes that are deemed "OP" by the pvp community).

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I agree with this, but I have a sneaking suspicion that either A) Healing will get nerfed again in arena or B) You'll see resilience start to affect healing in a negative manor. That's just wild speculation, but I wouldn't be surprised.

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Q u o t e:

We push niches for healers, to a small extent, so that players don't just say "Well, druids are the best healers. Let's take 6 of them." We want you to get a couple of druid healers and then think that you are probably better off getting a few different kinds of healers to balance out your raid. We want you to be able to raid if your best Holy priest is sick that night by getting a paladin, shaman or druid instead.

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I'm still having a hard time seeing why you can't substitute DPS classes into this statement and have it be any different... except you don't push niches for DPS, you do the opposite. Because you realized that "niches" were holding people back.

For all the irony with which it gets thrown around these days, "bring the player, not the class" is a good design philosophy. I just feel like the barriers you tore down for DPS are barriers for healers as well.

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Q u o t e:
The design intent is very simple, though it gets lawyered a lot by players asking for buffs.

We want to promote diversity and flexibility in the raid group.

Here are examples of what we DON'T want:

-- You have to have a shaman in every 5-player group within a raid.
-- You have to have 1 Holy paladin, 1 Disc priest, 2 Holy priests, 2 Resto shamans, 2 Resto druids.
-- You have 2 have 2 Holy paladins to heal the tanks.
-- You have to have an Unholy DK for Ebon Plague.
-- You have to have a warrior MT and a druid OT.
-- Etc.

We push niches for healers, to a small extent, so that players don't just say "Well, druids are the best healers. Let's take 6 of them." We want you to get a couple of druid healers and then think that you are probably better off getting a few different kinds of healers to balance out your raid. We want you to be able to raid if your best Holy priest is sick that night by getting a paladin, shaman or druid instead.

Some players like to claim the sky is falling after every set of patch notes, and to be fair, it's a pretty understandable reaction. But the fact is that the Ulduar raid groups have been more diverse than at any point in the history of WoW. Even the most competitive, cutting-edge guilds in the world don't all raid with the same mix of classes. From that perspective, the "bring the player" philosophy has been pretty succesful. This doesn't mean there are no balance problems (or even quality of life or fun issues) left to address. Let's just keep it in perspective. Not many guilds are running with 8 [fill in the blank of the preceived overpowered healer of the month, probably Resto druids currently], and nobody is going to start doing that in 3.2.

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Ah ha found you!

Can we get a response on the fire festival bugs in one of those posts?

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Q u o t e:
We want you to get a couple of druid healers and then think that you are probably better off getting a few different kinds of healers to balance out your raid.

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GC Misquote of the Day. <3

You have full permission to bonk me on the head if you see me at Blizzcon <3

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Q u o t e:



Can we get a response on the fire festival bugs in one of those posts?

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GC does not work with world events. That is a different department. If you've used the report a bug system in the game or in the forum, that's good enough and they know.

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Q u o t e:
Not many guilds are running with 8 [fill in the blank of the preceived overpowered healer of the month, probably Resto druids currently], and nobody is going to start doing that in 3.2.

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1) You can't do hard-mode content with over 6 healers. You'd run into strict enrage timers otherwise.
2) Druids will mathematically be the best single target healers next patch, and they're also the #1 class for mana longevity right now. I really wouldn't be surprised to see 3-4 druids brought to high-end raids next patch, out of a possible five or six healer slots.
3) You buffed the strongest, most self-sufficient PvE healing class this patch and nerfed the only class/spec that could compete with them (holy priest).

You're seeing a diverse group of healers right now because they are relatively well-balanced. Druids are the best healers at PvE raid damage, but they don't have a tank cooldown. Holy priests can do almost as well as them situationally, but they also provide Guardian Spirit which *MUST* be brought to several hard-modes now (tank instant-gibs).

It's almost as if having different, diverse niches are working out quite well for ensuring equal raid spots for each healer.

Paladins are brought to raids because we are by and far the best and most self-sufficient single target tank healer.

Shamans/disc priests are brought to raids because they do a fantastic job at buffering incoming tank damage and saving raid targets from the brink of death, although with the Nourish buff coupled with the Tidal Wave and Penance nerf, druids will be a LOT better at this current weakness of theirs.

You also nerfed replenishment, which hurts non-druid healers FAR more than druid healers. Druids, of course, are the only class that do not gem for intellect right now.

Next patch druids will by far be the best single target healers, will continue to be one of the top healers for countering large amounts of raid damage, AND will be able to save raid targets from the brink of death far better with the huge Nourish buff. All the while they will be doing this with far more mana longevity than any other healer, thanks to the Replenishment nerf which barely touches their hugely efficient mana pools. And they can combat res.

I'm pretty sure that healer balance is going to be thrown into upheaval next patch. Removing every single weakness from one of the strongest healers right now while simultaneously nerfing the strengths and mana regeneration of every other healer is *not* good for balance.

GC, just wondering but do you take any days off or do you read the forums at home?

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Not many guilds are running with 8 [fill in the blank of the preceived overpowered healer of the month, probably Resto druids currently], and nobody is going to start doing that in 3.2.

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You're right GC, guilds will not stack 8 of any one healer, druids, priests, you name it. They will, however, take 4 druids, 2 priests, and maybe one shaman. You are correct though, GC, they will not stack one single class of healer.

I'm curious how GC would respond to the current strat for Firefighter-25 pretty much requiring a stacking of Holy Nova spamming Priests to deal with the Flame jets during Phase 2.

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Q u o t e:
We want you to be able to raid if your best Holy priest is sick that night by getting a paladin, shaman or druid instead.

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paying $15 a month to be a substitute healer. no thanks.

This "Bring the player, not the class" quote has been blown way out of proportion. This was said after Sunwell raid stacking. If you have never done Sunwell before, our raid group would routinely carry at least 4 shamans, usually upwards of 5, because of stacking heroism and the incredible buff they brought to a raid. Holy priests were basically required to heal fights like the eredar twins and mass dispel was absolutely required for Felmyst. Or ask mages how Sunwell was, most of ours sat outside the instance while we brought 4 warlocks. No fights in Ulduar even come near the level of raid stacking required to do much of Sunwell.

Every healer shouldn't be able to perform every role as well as each other. I'm about as thrilled with the upcoming paladin changes as most other paladins, but atleast it seems to be a small (yet in my opinion not well thought out) step in making paladins more versatile healers. The Illum nerf seems a bit much, but the PTR will tell the real extent of the damage. The Beacon change was just plain lazy, but atleast they are recognizing that we have some serious limitations and are attempting to fix them. The only real problem will be when one healing class can not compete at anything with the other three healers, as many paladins fear is going to happen with the Illum nerf.

Basically, people are taking that "bring the player, not the class" quote way out of proportion.

"Not many guilds are running with 8 [fill in the blank of the preceived overpowered healer of the month, probably Resto druids currently], and nobody is going to start doing that in 3.2. "

Why did Ensidia take 4 priests for the world first Algalon 25 kill and not a single holly paladin? I doubt Ensidia doesn't have a skilled holly paladin that wanted to do the kill. Out of 30 diffrent specs in this game, 29 specs have at least 1 AoE spell at their disposal: either it's dps, tanking or healing spell, the only spec that doesn't have 1 AoE spell is the holly paladin tree :(

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Q u o t e:
We want to promote diversity and flexibility in the raid group.

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I think this has been done much more effectively than in the past. However, with that said...

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Q u o t e:
We want you to be able to raid if your best Holy priest is sick that night by getting a paladin, shaman or druid instead.

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A druid & to a lesser extent, a Shaman could cover the role of a Holy Priest. However, I do not believe that a Paladin can cover this role effectively even with the upcoming changes.

I do think that a lot of the Paladin outcry recently has been blown way out of proportion, but given the fact that Priests, Druids & Shaman all have the option of fulfilling both a raid healing and a tank healing role & Paladins have zero options when it comes to healing, I can sympathize with their plight. Option being the operative word.

I think having a niche is a good thing, but being so specialized at the detriment of fulfilling any other role is another. Hopefully my analysis is incorrect & 3.2 changes this.