World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Enhancement shaman

Orcares

< Zug Life >

Cho'gall

220. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:52:24 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

Yes. So slower weapons = good. :)

E, seriously then.... I just spent 2,625 arena points that I had to grind out to get a viable one-hand weapon to use in my offhand, which meets what you just said. All those points that I had to spend while any other duel-wielding class can spend like half those points to get a fast offhand... Why can't there be slow off hand weapons both at the arena vendor AND pre-Black Temple that are of a similar DPS/quality?

Please, name one place that a level 70 enh shaman can get a 2.6 speed or greater weapon for their offhand that does 90-ish DPS that can be found outside of a 25 man instance... You won't find them in Kara, which leaves ONLY arena grinding, which btw is being inhibited in the "minimum rating to purchase" planned for arena 3. I'm not saying that I disagree with the minimum rating idea, as we can respect those who PvP and they should have a leet look same as the end-gamers, but PLEASE give us some slow offhand weapons!

I would love your feedback on this. You even admit that we need slower weapons, but THEY ARE NOWHERE TO BE FOUND!

Lastly, much <3 for spending some time gracing us with your presence today... I can say that this is the first time in like FOREVER that I have felt a little love as a shaman.

Don't hate the player, hate the game.

Eyonix

Blizzard Poster

221. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:52:34 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
Please look into:
Relics
Quite honestly the current relics are very poor in quality. I believe many of us would be happier to be able to hold thrown/ranged weapons and not be able to use them (simply for the stats). I would even be happy if relics had straight stats similar to ranged weapons (+stam, +crit, etc)

The next problem is lack of choice. There are very few relics in the game. I have yet to see random uncommon or rare one's drop (random stats would be good). The ones we can get from vendors are 1-sided. Badge of Justice- Elemental, Arena Points- Resto. What about adding more for each spec?

Funny you should mention that!

We're adding new relics to support all talent trees in patch 2.3 for Shaman, Paladins and Druids. In addition, (not that this will sweep you off your feet), most of the arena-system relics have been renamed so there is a more consistent naming convention.

Eyonix

Blizzard Poster

222. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:53:50 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
I hope those changes (30% threat reduction and 30% damage reduction) aren't the only major changes coming. These look like they'll be major boosts for PvE, but won't help all that much in PvP. Most PvP enhancement shamans take nature's swiftness for an instant cast healing wave, so it seems all this change would do is make PvE spec enhancement shamans more viable in PvP, but wouldn't really help enhancement shamans at all in arenas, or at least not much.

If there are any forthcoming changes for enhancement PvP please let us know as soon as you're aware of them.

I know the thread is long, but try and go through each page. I''ve discussed a variety of changes.

Dispair

< Five Dollar Footlong >

Blackrock

223. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:54:27 AM PDT

Hmm... shamanistic rage is a pure pve ability, the usefulness of adding the 30% damage reduction to it is very limited. You wouldn't pull aggro in raid/party (supposingly, in addition to the new spirit weapon) except there is aoe or solo grinding. And I wouldn't think those will make us really need that 30% reduction in pve field.

Why don't you separate this as a new ability that is -30% damage + immune to CC for X second, this will clearly give us a clear idea that it is intended to be a pvp skill, and we will know when to use it . I am more happy to see tremor totem get improved (or grounding totem CD reduced) than just a mixed pve/pvp skill.

Havefaith

< Crunch >

Burning Blade

224. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:54:38 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

Funny you should mention that!

We're adding new relics to support all talent trees in patch 2.3 for Shaman, Paladins and Druids. In addition, (not that this will sweep you off your feet), most of the arena-system relics have been renamed so there is a more consistent naming convention.

Can you send me 2 Syphon of the Nathrezims please?

Mongoose on them too.

Thanks.

Chawana

< Cynosure >

Altar of Storms

225. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:55:13 AM PDT

thanks, Eyo. new relics ftw.

edit: as for NS for enhance pvp..yes, most shamans get it, but to be honest, when you get to 13k hp buffed in arenas, a 2.2k heal is nothing but a waste of mana. i'd much rather have something to regen my mana, and allow myself to survive a lot longer.

[ Post edited by Chawana ]

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=110413644&postId=1103942967&sid=1#0 Suggestion Compilation Thread.

Vyraal

< Ethereal >

Vek'nilash

226. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:55:25 AM PDT

Indirectly answered my questions, Great news, thanks a ton dude.

The new level 80 shaman skill is "Crusader Totem" which increases the mount speed of all party members within 30 yards of the totem.
Life is not a practice, always play to win.

Shiira

< Order of the Exiled >

Kel'Thuzad

227. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:55:31 AM PDT

Is there any plan to introduce more slow offhands for shamans, especially as arena rewards?

Its really frustrating to have to pay mainhand cost twice to get two slow arena weapons :_(.

Chutoi

< Calzowned >

Destromath

228. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:55:42 AM PDT

Let me offer an example, E.

I was dual weilding Merciless Gladiator's Right and Left Rippers. I was actually losing some dps on dual windfuries (still the best weapon buff out there) due to the speed of the offhand. Now, with the change in arena offhands from 1.8 to 1.5 speed, it is significantly more dps for me to use an AH 60 dps weapon in my offhand than it is for me to use the epic 97.5 dps offhand from the arena.

To get an equivalent epic to a rogue or whoever uses the Arena offhand, a shaman would have to purchase a 2nd one-hand weapon (such as the 2.6 speed axe) for 2600, instead of the 1100 that other dual wielding classes have to pay.

That is purely a function of the game mechanics. I would hope that people who purchased an arena offhand (one of the ones whose speed was changed in this patch) would be allowed an option to get a refund.

The change is a definite nerf for dual-wielding shaman--but not for any other class.

Vast

Dragonmaw

229. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:55:44 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

This is kind of a subjective, since everyone has their own idea of what's needed to be "effective". But yes, some of these changes will help in pvp. Such as the frostshock change (no longer subject to diminishing returns) and even the blood rage improvement - yes, I do realize it can be dispelled. At the same time, however, you've lost nothing when activating the ability and it's not always going to be dispelled, and certainly not always immediately going to be dispelled.

Can you suggest to the devs that they make it have some resistance to dispelling even if they dont want to make it completely undispellable? The priest discipline talent was given resistance because it was regarded as basically useless by most priests without it.

Enh shams have a serious gearing issue. There is very little +str mail and way too many pieces with 0 stam and loaded with practically useless mana/5. With the new talent reducing shock costs after crits, mana/5 is going to be even less useful.

Most higher ranked Enh Sham prefer to DW in pvp. The Enh PVP gear has 0 +hit on it but seems able to spend build points on MANA 5. Even a small amount of +hit in place of the mana 5 would be helpful. Enh sham spend so much time unable to reach thier opponents that the Elem bonus range to shocks is prefered over the Enh Arena glove bonus to lightning shield.

Can you ask the devs to do something about the shield block talent (Blizz has given up on supporting our off tank role already). The toughness talent is way too expensive for the small benefit it gives as well.

[ Post edited by Vast ]

Torentz

< Council of Discord >

Burning Blade

230. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:55:57 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
3) Gout really sucks.

Its so painful you literally consider chopping the affected limb off.

Unable to make it home in the midst of a flare up a couple of years back, I aborted from heading to my apartment to crashing at my mother's place. My foot was so sensitive that even propped up on an ottoman in a carpetted room I could feel in my foot every step my mother took even 10 feet away. (Needless to say your own heartbeat induces a fair amount of pain.)

[ Post edited by Torentz ]

Q: What do you tell a Naruu with two black eyes?

A: Nothing you ain't told it twice before.

Agripa

< l Exiled l >

Daggerspine

231. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:56:17 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

I realize it can be confusing for some, but those who care to really min-max (or at least really optimize there talents/gear, also take the time to research. Beyond this, I don't totally agree. It really depends on the green and purple.

Agreed, but as the previous poster mentioned, the fact that this has been normalized for rogues and warrior abilities means that the devs do want rogues and warriors to not be limited by weapon speed. Why are enhancement shamans forced to limited OH itemization due to this (no good 71+ dps OH PvE drop until very late in the progression)?
On a related note, please tell me ZA will some 90+ OH. I really don't like arena and I am forced to do it because that's the only upgrade to my Runic Hammer.

Stawt

< Alliance in Defiance >

Dalaran

232. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:57:14 AM PDT

Posting in THE epic Shaman Thread!

Froshaw

< Who Is John Galt >

Suramar

233. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:57:43 AM PDT

can i ask that this thread get stickied or another thread compiling of all the information you have posted be made, with a sticky?

there are too many shaman who ask for the answers you have provided on these forums, and unfortunately the thread title for this thread doesn't indicate any of this information being given.

regardless, thanks a lot for all the info.

If you try to do good dps its called being a good damage dealer. If you accidentally do good dps its called being a Warlock.

Koruh

Frostmane

234. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:58:10 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

I know the thread is long, but try and go through each page. I''ve discussed a variety of changes.

And every post you make in the thread except the last one, has a Next Blue post icon and link in the top right so you can skip straight to the blue posts.

I know this is the shaman forum, but I'm going to keep asking....What is the status of the prot pally changes, everything discussed for 2.3 is ret, and we've had zero information since the Blue tanking hierarchy post before 2.1. We have no idea where we even stand.

Aakildia

< Clan of the Red Drag… >

Malygos

235. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:58:12 AM PDT

E just needs to go read the class mechanics at Elitest Jerks.

http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t13297-enhance_shaman_collected_works_theorycraft_vol_i/

"Taken from the Thread on Elitest Jerks" "All props to Keiji"
Quote
Windfury Mechanics
Windfury Weapon was corrected in the 2.1 patch to trigger a hidden/internal 3 second cooldown. As a result, OH procs now (correctly) trigger the cooldown on the MH. Despite this set back to shaman DPS (net loss of about 10-15% DPS for enhancement shaman), Windfury Weapon is still the best weapon imbue to use – even the developers admitted to as much in their IRC chat, when they said they have no intention to scale the other weapon imbues to match the power of Windfury.

The cooldown on Windfury Weapon means that an OH that is faster than the MH is extremely detrimental to shaman DPS. The fast OH is more likely to hit again after a WF cooldown and therefore has the first opportunity to proc a new WF and trigger the cooldown again. OH interference prevents MH WF procs and thus reduces your DPS. It has been shown that this cooldown interference is so severe that replacing an epic dagger OH with a green or blue 2.6 speed OH will actually increase your DPS. (Again, despite this problem, it is still preferrable to have WF on the OH. Any WF proc, even on the OH, will result in more DPS over time than FlameTongue or Rockbiter on the OH.)

Eyonix

Blizzard Poster

236. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:58:50 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
Good point some previous poster brought up. What's the chances of seeing the generally considered useless Tanking talents in the enhancement tree replaced? Specifically Shield Block, Anticipation and Toughness. Are there any plans to remove, replace and/or review/change these talents? If Blizz wants to leave them, what justification is there to leave them, and to ever pick them other than as a joke build?

It is very possible that these could change for the future, but more than likely Wrath of the Lich King would be the earliest we'd focus on these talents. I am only speculating mind you. Or rather, more of an educated guess.

Q u o t e:
Another concern is the amount of mp/5 and int we still see on enhance gear (although non shaman-bound gear is often hunter as well). Are the devs, etc. aware of how useless these 2 stats are for raiding PvE shaman? I know a lot of shaman use leather to avoid those stats and pick up the more useful rogue oriented stats (which are also the stats we want).

I've not done an extensive review of the item changes going into 2.3. If there is anything to address this concern, I'll let you know. Regardless though, your point is noted.

[ Post edited by Eyonix ]

Shawkenaw

< The Kingdom >

Feathermoon

237. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 11:59:27 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
And really, unless blizzard is giving enhance shaman a charge, I don't see how making this ability undispellable would be overpowered, especially when compared to a warlock's constant soul link and a hunter's undispellable, and the arguably more powerful bestial wrath of BM hunters.

Arguably? 18 seconds of being 'unstoppable' is, by itself, much more powerful than Shamanistic Rage, even with the damage reduction. The extra damage and mana reduction just emphasizes the fact.

Eyonix

Blizzard Poster

238. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 12:01:47 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

And on that note, Eyonix, can you find whoever the heck is in charge of the tooltips to actually bring this cooldown into the tooltip description? Part of the problem is that not all players read the forums and are simply ignorant to the cooldown.

While I still stand behind my point on the matter, your suggestion is most certainly worth passing along.

I mean, what's the worst that can happen -- they fire me... Oh, wait. :/

Hmmbeef

< Chaos Sworn >

Madoran

239. Re: Enhancement shaman - Low blow 09/26/2007 12:02:08 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

I realize it can be confusing for some, but those who care to really min-max (or at least really optimize there talents/gear, also take the time to research. Beyond this, I don't totally agree. It really depends on the green and purple.

the point is they shouldn't have to research why they just picked up a 30 dps upgrade and their damage went down...if wf can onl y proc once every 3 seconds the tool tip should say so, and why would the devs go back to a system that they intentionally removed 2 years ago? and if the devs want shaman to use slow weps why haven't we had more of them put in the game?

i am sure the devs didn't sit down and say "hey i have a really great idea we will change the way wf works so shaman will use green weps purchased from the ah.....and never have to roll on anything kara or beyond, and we will not tell them this...... go get the pop corn lets watch the fun that ensues."

green oh's being better than 30+ dps upgrades clearly was a mistake and a unforseen change brought on by a unlisted 3 second cool down

[ Post edited by Hmmbeef ]

http://tsericdown.ytmnd.com/
p.s. nerf shaman why you ask????? why not?

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