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Q u o t e:
the developers coninuously nerf every spell that accounts for more than 30% of druid healing done in a raid, in hopes we'll use our other spells more. If they buff one of the shaman spells and you don't ever use anything else, blizzard will just nerf it again. What's the point?

Why don't we just stop worshiping healing meters that are often wrong, or don't really tell us what's going on?

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As much as I hate meter lust (as do most people), ignoring them altogether is equally stupid : \ Smart people can get the information they need from WWS reports.

woa woa woa, baby steps! GC admitted there is a shaman pvp problem, let's not get carried away and think he'll post on pve shamans being broken as well.

I was always top or top 3 in BC raiding as resto

and tbh I rarely used chain heal

just cuz I was quick to spot heal and fast and good enough to do it

I don't think I usually utilized chain heal much ever now and then I would but I just would be ignorant to the fact I could use it.

I don't buy into this whole "OMG WE CANT HEALZ" train

so my honest opinion here...

L2P

No Ulduar achievements? Check
Just cleared Naxx last month? Check (lol)
Unenchanted crafted/quest reward gear? Check
Hasn't cleared any BC raids? Check

Smells like troll.

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Q u o t e:
I was always top or top 3 in BC raiding as resto

and tbh I rarely used chain heal

just cuz I was quick to spot heal and fast and good enough to do it

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This isn't TBC and you haven't seen how bad !!!@ hits the fan in Ulduar yet.

Quick spot healing doesn't translate into Shamans being useful. Not even close. To actually keep people alive, you need to have some ridiculous 10k+ peak HPS values in Ulduar hard modes. Shamans just aren't capable of doing that at the moment.

Spot healing is a low HPS, high response time job. It makes other healers overheal because you're faster than them, and subsequently pads your numbers for nothing.

Trust me when I say that your spot healing will mean absolutely *nothing* against Hodir or Mimiron.

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Q u o t e:


This isn't TBC and you haven't seen how bad !!!@ hits the fan in Ulduar yet.

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True.

I recant most of my post....

but still, I've healed many MMOs and RPGs.... sorry if I sound full of myself but I'm pro maybe not tip top but Im up there. How do I know? cuz I've heard it every tiem I've healed, not once have I been chewed out through text cuz my healin is crap

so anyways, based on that.. I still think Chain Heal doesn't effect healing THAT much

but again, I haven't rolled resto this patch cuz I like DPS on my shaman.. my druid can heal for now I have yet to be called to heal on my shammy which I will gladly do if need be.

till then I'll stick to my guns and say L2P.. and if I roll resto and am pleasently takin it from behind suprised I will even tell myself L2P and heal with a tail between my legs

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Q u o t e:
Honest question, if you were to change chain heal to only lose roughly 10-15% per jump, and give it 2-3 extra yards, would that about take care of it?

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In some senses yes, it would give us some much needed HPS and throughput, but I'd rather have the whole, "we're balancing a 2.5 second base cast heal against instant casts that heal for more" thing addressed first. It's not like CH's "spammability" somehow makes up for this, when Blizzard didn't exactly leave Priests and Druids weak for those 3 GCDs between those CoH/WGs that required a CD they were so powerful.

I'd rather keep a halfway meaningful jump penalty, maybe 25% to 40% or so, extend the range to 15 yards (this is pretty much mandatory no matter what happens), and reduce the cast time on CH by .5 seconds.

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Q u o t e:
In BC, I quit my druid and rolled a shaman because chain heal easily topped all the healing meters back then without even having to think...

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We're in WotLK now. This expansion is about rolling Druids and facerolling rejuv to easily top the meters.

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Q u o t e:
I know, but why would you guys want chain heal buffed so that you never have to cast anything else? What you really seem to need are more interesting & diverse tools rather than buffing the buttons you already use...

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Buffing CH to a competitive place wouldn't stop me from casting LHW, as LHW is actually good now, is very fast, has a purpose, and won't OOM you in under a minute. When I "CH spam" a fight in WotLK, it's like...60% of my healing, not the 90% it was in TBC. And if you think 60% is too high, you need to remember that 60% of every CH is a very substantial single target heal. So you're basically looking at a break down of 36% CH initial cast, 30% CH bounces, 20% LHW, with ES, AA procs, and Riptide making up the rest. It's really not that unreasonable of a breakdown at all for a healer that is designed to use one heal a lot.

-- I read all of these threads. Many other Blizzard employees do too. 

-- If you make good points, then trust that we have gotten the message. You do not need a blue response to indicate that we have gotten the message. 

-- Please do not complain about which posts we respond to or why. 

-- As a rule of thumb, the better posts tend to discuss classes and mechanics and not Blizzard itself. :)

vvodka, remember yesterday, when GC said that they want to wait longer and see if everyone if dropping shamans in hard modes or jsut the top guilds? ya, when the data starts coming in the THE MASSES don't bring shaman healers to the cutting edge, then Blizz will say, "it, shammy healing is out of whack enough for us to do things".

I think its because they don't try to completely balance everything and since top guild people are more likely to reroll for a specific thing like shammy vs holy priest than a casual, having top end imbalance isn't a too bad of thing.

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Q u o t e:
vvodka, remember yesterday, when GC said that they want to wait longer and see if everyone if dropping shamans in hard modes or jsut the top guilds? ya, when the data starts coming in the THE MASSES don't bring shaman healers to the cutting edge, then Blizz will say, "it, shammy healing is out of whack enough for us to do things".

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It would be a ##%!ing shame if GC ignores the numbers and parses, ignores the top guilds, and decides to wait until regular guilds started dropping resto shaman in masses before deciding to balance things.

Did he actually say that? Do you have a link? The only GC statement I found was: We haven't made any changes to Illumination or Replenishment at this point in time. We need to see some of the less bleeding-edge expert guilds try hard modes, where by most accounts mana regen starts to matter very much.
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=17345434393&pageNo=6&sid=1#106

http://wowwebstats.com/ttfuoewq6olk3

My guild's WWS for Hodir death and Thorim attempts.

Guess who's leading the pack on healing?

You guessed it, resto shaman.

And it's not because I've gimped myself as a resto druid. It's partially to do with the way healing is being done in the Thorim fight, the shaman was in the arena and I was in the gauntlet.

Either way, shamans still place fairly nicely.

This WWS is compiled by 2-3 different combat logs. Drill down to the Hodir fight, the shaman did 20,000 more healing than I did.

http://wowwebstats.com/ttfuoewq6olk3?s=145870-223160&a=x700000000d8aab1

His top heal during that fight? Chain Heal.

In fact, that's seeming to be the only real heal he used.

In contrast:

http://wowwebstats.com/ttfuoewq6olk3?s=145870-223160&a=x7000000020cb512

My WWS for that fight shows a much wider balance of heals used to obtain similar numbers.

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Q u o t e:
http://wowwebstats.com/ttfuoewq6olk3
My guild's WWS for Hodir death and Thorim attempts.
Guess who's leading the pack on healing?
You guessed it, resto shaman.

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Split it out on Boss Kills vs trash. Trash healing is irrelevant. On the boss kills, the priest is 25% ahead of everyone else.
http://wowwebstats.com/ttfuoewq6olk3?s=bossdown
http://wowwebstats.com/ttfuoewq6olk3?s=trash

I don't want to faceroll CH the entire raid. I'd prefer that CH get a 6s CD, and then buffed to be worthy of the CD.

It's just a stupid design for GC to think it is ok for one spec of one class to spam an ability 80% of the time, while every other class mixes up their abilities much more.

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Q u o t e:
In BC, I quit my druid and rolled a shaman because chain heal easily topped all the healing meters back then without even having to think...

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Much like how resto druids can face roll over their insta rejuvs and hit 7k HPS on fights like IC with steelbreaker last. We get it, you're bitter.

Tenjin, please don't post WoW Web Stats. Use another service.

WWS has a known issue where it cannot parse Healing Stream Totem properly and assumes all of its healing is effective, while in reality it has generally upwards of 70% overhealing. It counts as a pet and the site's algorithms just don't know how to deal with a pet doing healing.

It gives misleading and untruthful values that makes people derive extremely faulty conclusions from the data.

Let me point the confused souls in the right direction...

The current situation is not ok because:

1) Chain Heal is iconic, and we're not using it.

2) Our other options are pretty flavor-less, sort of like gimp paladins.


Overall the problem is pretty obvious: people are spread out in many encounters + raid damage happens fast and is not true aoe but it's targeted,

possible solutions include reducing cast time to 1.5 sec, increasing the jump range by 10 yd or so


Idea: Currently RT/ CH hasten our single target heals. Maybe if our single target heals hasted our chain heal it would create a more strategic playstyle

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Q u o t e:
We're not convinced there is a Resto or Chain Heal problem in PvE.

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I stopped reading there.

No offense, but if you're not convinced there is a Resto Shaman/Chain Heal Problem in PvE, you need to go do Hard Modes in Ulduar. Or do you think healers like Meka of Ensidia need to play better?

I'll edit this post in a bit to add parses to this.

Edit:This isn't to say that Shamans explicitly need to be buffed. Maybe you think Healing in Ulduar is too strong, and you want to nerf Priests/Druids. I don't know what direction you want to take healing in, but what I do know is that Shamans are significantly relatively weaker than Druids and Priests at raid healing in Ulduar.

I'll start off with a fight where there is plenty of opportunity to use Chain Heal. This is Deus Vox.

http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/3799515#healingout

Blood Legion, same fight.

http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/4001437#healingout

Lowest common denominator is all i have to say.

We're fine for ulduar normal modes, taking 6 paladins is fine for ulduar normal modes, we however are not fine for ulduar hard modes where spacing 10+ yards apart becomes a priority for anyone not in melee. I guess the only effective raid healing we're supposed to do is on that one portion of the raid. A portion of the raid that subsequently tends to shrink the harder the content gets.

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Q u o t e:
We're not convinced there is a Resto or Chain Heal problem in PvE.

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Dissapointing. I know you've seen the posts, the parses, the arguments, and the data presented to back them up. What do the devs think Resto brings that justifies them a raid slot? A Resto Shaman simply cannot keep up with an hPriest or Druid on AoE heals, and they cannot keep up with a dPriest or Paladin on tank healing. What function do the devs believe they have that makes you want to bring a Resto Shaman instead of one of the healers that can do the job better?