World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes

Nerodius

< Wanderers >

Whisperwind

40. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 11:46:11 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

Thanks for the reply, but that doesn't really address my concern. Why didn't you keep the rating ceilings where they were, and simply change the items to have bracket-specific requirements?

I don't really accept the idea that it would be too confusing to players. Point gains are bracket-specific, why can't point spending be bracket-specific too?

I assume because they don't have a way to hotfix the rating check being per-bracket, and that even if they did implement it, it would cause tool tip bloat and potentially player confusion. Those things might not matter to you or affect you, but past experience has shown they are important to Blizzard.

Plus it makes skill level based on arena rating more consistent through the brackets. Like how right now on AJ there's a different posting requirement for each bracket.

In the end, the cleaner solution is to make the various brackets' ratings more consistent, rather than having three separate rating requirements listed for every item.

Klops

< Pro Baddies >

Mal'Ganis

41. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 11:53:34 AM PDT

well yes, "in the end" i'm sure we all agree that is the ideal situation.

Maeglin

< Spelling Socialists >

Khadgar

42. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 11:56:46 AM PDT

So just so we're clear, now people who don't raid for PvP weapons are even MORE screwed?

Ok, just making sure.

I don't know why I even bother with this game anymore. I only play to PvP and do solo stuff, I hate raiding, and you guys just keep kicking me in the junk by making it more and more impossible for me to get the rating to get the better-than-ilvl-200 weapons I NEED to REACH the rating for the 239 weapons in the first place.

I mean this in all seriousness, what the heck? Where are the weapons for people who want to arena and don't want to raid and want to reach those high ratings?

"The right to offend is central to the right to free speech."

"This is the patch where WoW becomes self-aware and Skynet activates." - Maaven

Nerodius

< Wanderers >

Whisperwind

43. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 11:56:53 AM PDT

Then what's the problem? Better to do it earlier rather than later.

Edit: Yeah, I'm sure it's your gear holding you back......

[ Post edited by Nerodius ]

Affixqc

Arena Tournament 1

44. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:00:10 PM PDT

Q u o t e:
I assume because they don't have a way to hotfix the rating check being per-bracket, and that even if they did implement it, it would cause tool tip bloat and potentially player confusion. Those things might not matter to you or affect you, but past experience has shown they are important to Blizzard.

Plus it makes skill level based on arena rating more consistent through the brackets. Like how right now on AJ there's a different posting requirement for each bracket.

In the end, the cleaner solution is to make the various brackets' ratings more consistent, rather than having three separate rating requirements listed for every item.

I'd agree with you if we were talking about, say, the PR requirement on the Furious Bracers. Something really low, something that a lot of people are going to have access to.

But you're talking about the rating requirement on an item that the top ~1% of the arena population will acquire. Are you really worried about confusing these people? These are the best of the best players in the world, who for the most part, know the game ridiculously well and aren't going to be troubled by a confusing tooltip.

I guess I just expect a greater level of respect for the ladder system than they're willing to offer. It honestly isn't a huge deal, I just think it is sort of silly to fix the solution this way when there are less obtrusive ways available.

Q u o t e:
So just so we're clear, now people who don't raid for PvP weapons are even MORE screwed?

Ok, just making sure.

I don't know why I even bother with this game anymore. I only play to PvP and do solo stuff, I hate raiding, and you guys just keep kicking me in the junk by making it more and more impossible for me to get the rating to get the better-than-ilvl-200 weapons I NEED to REACH the rating for the 239 weapons in the first place.

I mean this in all seriousness, what the heck? Where are the weapons for people who want to arena and don't want to raid and want to reach those high ratings?

You can make excuses all you want, but the difference between a 232 and a 239 weapon is not why you're unsuccessful. I don't mean this to troll, but rather to point out that it is a mostly trivial stat difference.

[ Post edited by Affixqc ]

Affix of Tichondrius, <Quality Control>
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Tichondrius&n=Affix
http://www.xfire.com/live_video/millenn1um/

Maeglin

< Spelling Socialists >

Khadgar

45. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:01:32 PM PDT

Q u o t e:
I guess I just expect a greater level of respect for the ladder system than they're willing to offer. It honestly isn't a huge deal, I just think it is sort of silly to fix the solution this way when there are less obtrusive ways available.

What part of "temporary" did you miss?

They're making a "less obtrusive" fix in the next season. This is a stopgap.

"The right to offend is central to the right to free speech."

"This is the patch where WoW becomes self-aware and Skynet activates." - Maaven

Bornakk

Blizzard Poster

46. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:02:53 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

Thanks for the reply, but that doesn't really address my concern. Why didn't you keep the rating ceilings where they were, and simply change the items to have bracket-specific requirements?

I don't really accept the idea that it would be too confusing to players. Point gains are bracket-specific, why can't point spending be bracket-specific too?

We like the way these changes affected the system and prefer it to work this way as opposed to making it more complex and harder for players to follow.

Klops

< Pro Baddies >

Mal'Ganis

47. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:03:13 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

What part of "temporary" did you miss?

They're making a "less obtrusive" fix in the next season. This is a stopgap.

what are you talking about

[ Post edited by Klops ]

Affixqc

Arena Tournament 1

48. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:03:56 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

What part of "temporary" did you miss?

They're making a "less obtrusive" fix in the next season. This is a stopgap.

I think you're either confused as to their timetable, or not understanding my concern. Here's their timetable:

RIGHT NOW: Raise requirements to 2350
VERY SOON: Raise point gains in 3v3/5v5 so that the top of the ladder inflates
SEASON 7: Revert weapon rating requirement changes, deflate 2v2/3v3/5v5 ratings

My issue is with the 'very soon' part. It is unecessary, all they need to do is make bracket-specific requirements.

Affix of Tichondrius, <Quality Control>
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Tichondrius&n=Affix
http://www.xfire.com/live_video/millenn1um/

Affixqc

Arena Tournament 1

49. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:05:20 PM PDT

Q u o t e:
We like the way these changes affected the system and prefer it to work this way as opposed to making it more complex and harder for players to follow.

Okay, thanks. I don't agree with your decision, but I really do appreciate that you were willing to at least explain why you ended up with the decision that you did.

Affix of Tichondrius, <Quality Control>
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Tichondrius&n=Affix
http://www.xfire.com/live_video/millenn1um/

Klops

< Pro Baddies >

Mal'Ganis

50. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:08:26 PM PDT

lol, do they think we get through life finding labels on things confusing

MEN'S BATHROOM <---------> WOMAN'S BATHROOM

%#@! WHERE DO I GO

now, if you started writing the tooltips in chinese and german, i might be confused.

its only as complicated as its written.

[ Post edited by Klops ]

Maeglin

< Spelling Socialists >

Khadgar

51. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:09:34 PM PDT

Q u o t e:
You can make excuses all you want, but the difference between a 232 and a 239 weapon is not why you're unsuccessful. I don't mean this to troll, but rather to point out that it is a mostly trivial stat difference.

How about the difference between a 200 and a 232 weapon? Because that's the best I can get without raiding. That's not quite so trivial, and it still takes a fairly long time to reach if you're just stepping into arena for the first time. All I'd like to see is even a 213 weapon specifically made for PvP (like the arena weapons are) available for honor, or a mix of honor and points. I'm hardly going to say I CAN'T make it there, but it makes no sense to me that such a thing doesn't exist when people are already stepping into arena at 0 rank with Ulduar weapons, and I can't get ANYTHING before 1850 unless I raid.

To provide an example:

Titansteel Bonecrusher
Binds when equipped
Unique-Equipped
Main Hand Mace
251 - 467 Damage Speed 2.50
(143.6 damage per second)
(1243 feral attack power)
+59 Stamina
Durability 105 / 105
Requires Level 80
Equip: Increases your expertise rating by 29 (3.54 @ L80).
Equip: Increases attack power by 140.

Furious Gladiator's Pummeler
Binds when picked up
One-Hand Mace
325 - 605 Damage Speed 2.60
(178.8 damage per second)
(1736 feral attack power)
+78 Stamina
Blue Socket
Socket Bonus: +8 Attack Power
Durability 105 / 105
Requires Level 80
Requires personal and team arena rating of 1850
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 26 (0.57% @ L80).
Equip: Improves your resilience rating by 34 (0.41% @ L80).
Equip: Increases attack power by 86.

While people are now starting arena, brand-new, with ilvl 219 gear they can get in a pickup group off the first boss of Ulduar.

"The right to offend is central to the right to free speech."

"This is the patch where WoW becomes self-aware and Skynet activates." - Maaven

Lithilium

< Horde Birth Control >

Bleeding Hollow

52. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:11:43 PM PDT

Wow isn't that cute i had 2400 in 2v2 and tanked the rating last night to 2300 now i better manage to get it back up to at least 2350 or i'm going to be pissed that this change happens out of the blue with no warning whats so ever

Affixqc

Arena Tournament 1

53. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:12:26 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

How about the difference between a 200 and a 232 weapon? Because that's the best I can get without raiding. That's not quite so trivial, and it still takes a fairly long time to reach if you're just stepping into arena for the first time. All I'd like to see is even a 213 weapon specifically made for PvP (like the arena weapons are) available for honor, or a mix of honor and points. I'm hardly going to say I CAN'T make it there, but it makes no sense to me that such a thing doesn't exist when people are already stepping into arena at 0 rank with Ulduar weapons, and I can't get ANYTHING before 1850 unless I raid.

200 vs 232 is a problem specific to S5->S6. They made the arena weapons too low iLevel in S5, and didn't correct the mistake going in to S6. It isn't unreasonable to expect someone to hit 1850 with an iLevel 200 weapon... but at the very least, it is only a problem right now, and a problem they've acknowledged with the bump up to 232/239 in S6.

Affix of Tichondrius, <Quality Control>
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Tichondrius&n=Affix
http://www.xfire.com/live_video/millenn1um/

Lôcke

Mannoroth

54. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:19:02 PM PDT

Can we expect any change to the formula to arena points if the long term goal is to make it possible to get higher rankings in all brackets?

Let me iterate: if an average skilled 5v5 team is supposed to get the same rating than an average skilled 2v2 team yet gets 450 more arena points, I think Id go for the 5v5 team just for points and tighten it up and go for 3v3 or 2v2 later in the season when Im looking to snag a title. More or less killing 2v2. =(

Vakerik

< Lordaeron Philharmon… >

Altar of Storms

55. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:20:05 PM PDT

Has this happened as of RIGHT now?

Klops

< Pro Baddies >

Mal'Ganis

56. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:23:04 PM PDT

the change to 2350 is already in.

Klops

< Pro Baddies >

Mal'Ganis

57. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:24:56 PM PDT

Q u o t e:
Can we expect any change to the formula to arena points if the long term goal is to make it possible to get higher rankings in all brackets?

Let me iterate: if an average skilled 5v5 team is supposed to get the same rating than an average skilled 2v2 team yet gets 450 more arena points, I think Id go for the 5v5 team just for points and tighten it up and go for 3v3 or 2v2 later in the season when Im looking to snag a title. More or less killing 2v2. =(

i think anything that encourages 3v3/5v5 is a good thing compared to 2v2 at this point.

also id imagine their arena points formula is under the assumption that the ratings aren't skewed across the brackets as they are.

[ Post edited by Klops ]

Nerodius

< Wanderers >

Whisperwind

58. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:33:34 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

I guess I just expect a greater level of respect for the ladder system than they're willing to offer. It honestly isn't a huge deal, I just think it is sort of silly to fix the solution this way when there are less obtrusive ways available.

Remember season 5? :P

It'll all sort itself out within 3 weeks or less anyway, amongst the people who would actually care. And that's, what, 10% of a full ladder season? Maybe a little more?

Smacken

< Akai Soubi >

Uther

59. Re: Arena Rating System & Requirement Changes 05/07/2009 12:35:58 PM PDT

Q u o t e:

And how long did it take till a guild took illidian down?

PvE is just as big of a joke. Look at Naxx. Everyone and their mother has full 7.5 . Half the players don't even know anything about the game but the few buttons they press on their dps rotation

Guilds took down Illidan in days then spent the next 6 months or more killing again until he dropped his weapons on a random chance.

They didn't march to the vendor and buy their gear the way you are accustomed to doing.

[ Post edited by Smacken ]

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