World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Please clarify for the Warlocks

Triq

Arena Tournament 1

0. Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 10:42:30 AM PDT

Let them hear it from you. Tell them exactly why Fear was nerfed. Please inform them that it is not meant to be part of a CC chain 20-30 seconds long with damage being spammed into them.

Tell them that Fear - Fear - Fear - Strangulate - HoJ - Gnaw - Fel hunter Silence is NOT balanced in arena.

Inform them of the difference between stuns for classes that require melee range and CC for ranged classes.

Please, so we can just end this nonsensical posting.

Obladesque

< Iliad >

Stormrage

2. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 10:52:56 AM PDT

You see, I don't care about warlocks.

I do, however, care about shadowpriests.

Our fear IS on a cooldown!

The 3 second tremble from the new horror probably shares diminishing returns with our fear, and also is probably classified as a fear, and therefore also fails!

That leaves 0 snares, 0 fears, 1 silence (3 seconds ish), and 1 disarm (10 seconds, 5 with most talents)

We are already squishy as hell!

(mind flay does not count as a snare, as you have to be standing still, 20yards away for it to work)

Triq

Arena Tournament 1

3. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 10:59:53 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
You see, I don't care about warlocks.

I do, however, care about shadowpriests.

Our fear IS on a cooldown!

The 3 second tremble from the new horror probably shares diminishing returns with our fear, and also is probably classified as a fear, and therefore also fails!

That leaves 0 snares, 0 fears, 1 silence (3 seconds ish), and 1 disarm (10 seconds, 5 with most talents)

We are already squishy as hell!

(mind flay does not count as a snare, as you have to be standing still, 20yards away for it to work)

So then how about this. Use your fear THE WAY ITS SUPPOSED TO BE USED. Fear + Blind/Poly one target, and use the STUNS from rogue/mage (our best arena partners) to kill something.

Catching on? STUN to kill, FEAR to CC. Obviously thats the way it was meant to be and if you can't tell, Blizzard feels the same which is why its being nerfed.

If you're rambling on about 1v1's in BGs and being inadequate then I suggest the following. Queue with the classes you have synergy with. Blizzard has said time and time again that PvP is a group game, not a solo game.

[ Post edited by Triq ]

Kotaki

Alleria

4. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:02:56 AM PDT

troll priest is no better than a level 1 forum alt with no games under her fat belt

Gutyu

The Venture Co

5. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:03:41 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
Let them hear it from you. Tell them exactly why Fear was nerfed. Please inform them that it is not meant to be part of a CC chain 20-30 seconds long with damage being spammed into them.

Tell them that Fear - Fear - Fear - Strangulate - HoJ - Gnaw - Fel hunter Silence is NOT balanced in arena.

Inform them of the difference between stuns for classes that require melee range and CC for ranged classes.

Please, so we can just end this nonsensical posting.

Oh I see so you believe they should nerf one class with the least defensive capabilities based on a comp with 2 strong close to OP classes and not those classes, maybe.

This is surely not nonesical at all.

Obladesque

< Iliad >

Stormrage

6. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:04:41 AM PDT

Ah, I finally understand what you are saying!

ONLY the classes that have stuns can kill things, while the classes with fears can just be annoying until diminishing returns makes them dead.

Somehow that doesn't fit in with the whole bring the player, not the class thing.

But hey, if that's how you see it, that's how you see it.

Triq

Arena Tournament 1

7. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:09:44 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
Ah, I finally understand what you are saying!

ONLY the classes that have stuns can kill things, while the classes with fears can just be annoying until diminishing returns makes them dead.

Somehow that doesn't fit in with the whole bring the player, not the class thing.

But hey, if that's how you see it, that's how you see it.

"Only the classes that have stuns can kill things"? What a completely ignorant thing to say and taken WAY out of context from ANYTHING I said.

I know shadow isn't great right now but guess what its getting buffed. And when you play real group PvP the way it was meant to be played you will start to see that certain abilities, when meshed together, create OP scenarios. For example being able to spam damage into a fear followed by a full stunlock from a class that needs stunlock as a given form of utility to stick to their target for damage becomes incredibly imbalanced.

I don't know if I can make it any clearer for you.

Triq

Arena Tournament 1

8. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:14:28 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

Oh I see so you believe they should nerf one class with the least defensive capabilities based on a comp with 2 strong close to OP classes and not those classes, maybe.

This is surely not nonesical at all.

It doesn't matter what classes they are with. Bring any other combination of classes that bring stun/silence to chain with a full CC and spam damage into.

How about we just let hunters explosive shot into an unbreakable sheep that doesn't restore HP then follow it with silencing shot/felhunter silence/deathcoil/pin? Would you call that balanced?

Of course not. You're missing the reasoning behind the whole nerf. And the reason for this is that you have a completely skewed vision of what PvP is. You probably have %%@*ty gear and play on a %%@*ty arena team if any at all.

You're major concern is about not dying in a BG where you can afk your way to free honor and get the gear you want. Whereas the people who are fighting for ratings that give them the best PvP gear have to deal with this stupid nonsense that is fear - stun spam and lose points/waste time to skilless scrubs who can kill something in FULL RESILIENCE with this kind of extended "stunlock", and I guarantee you that DK/Lock/Pal isn't the only comp that is capable of this, just the most scrub friendly and the current FOTM.

Obladesque

< Iliad >

Stormrage

9. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:19:43 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

"Only the classes that have stuns can kill things"? What a completely ignorant thing to say and taken WAY out of context from ANYTHING I said.

I know shadow isn't great right now but guess what its getting buffed. And when you play real group PvP the way it was meant to be played you will start to see that certain abilities, when meshed together, create OP scenarios. For example being able to spam damage into a fear followed by a full stunlock from a class that needs stunlock as a given form of utility to stick to their target for damage becomes incredibly imbalanced.

I don't know if I can make it any clearer for you.

Yes, I agree with you, they do need stunlock to stick to their target for damage.

However, warlocks need fear to stick to their target without getting blown up.

I don't understand why one is getting nerfed out of the water, and the other is staying the same.

A good solution to me would be increase diminishing returns a bit, or reduce the time of fear a little, not making completely useless like this.

Thona

Turalyon

10. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:20:45 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
Let them hear it from you. Tell them exactly why Fear was nerfed. Please inform them that it is not meant to be part of a CC chain 20-30 seconds long with damage being spammed into them.

Tell them that Fear - Fear - Fear - Strangulate - HoJ - Gnaw - Fel hunter Silence is NOT balanced in arena.

Inform them of the difference between stuns for classes that require melee range and CC for ranged classes.

Please, so we can just end this nonsensical posting.

stuns are fine though, lulz

Lesath

< The Usual Suspects >

Cenarius

11. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:21:23 AM PDT

Tell them I'm right, mommy!

Gerrick

< Neltharions Fury >

Kael'thas

12. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:22:55 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

"Only the classes that have stuns can kill things"? What a completely ignorant thing to say and taken WAY out of context from ANYTHING I said.

I know shadow isn't great right now but guess what its getting buffed. And when you play real group PvP the way it was meant to be played you will start to see that certain abilities, when meshed together, create OP scenarios. For example being able to spam damage into a fear followed by a full stunlock from a class that needs stunlock as a given form of utility to stick to their target for damage becomes incredibly imbalanced.

I don't know if I can make it any clearer for you.

I hear that having a rogue and mage/DK/Pally/Hunter/any class that deals damage while you're stunned by the rogue with CS/KS is OP... better nerf everyone...

Of course there are going to be OP combinations genius. Better just give us all a wet paper bag for armor and soggy piece of bread to beat each other with... that's the only way there won't ever be OP combinations of abilities.

Fear is used offensively by a lot of warlocks because it takes us 15+ seconds to deal the same amount of damage nearly every class can do to us in 3 seconds. Fix that imbalance and we won't have a problem.

Gutyu

The Venture Co

14. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:24:26 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

It doesn't matter what classes they are with. Bring any other combination of classes that bring stun/silence to chain with a full CC and spam damage into.

How about we just let hunters explosive shot into an unbreakable sheep that doesn't restore HP then follow it with silencing shot/felhunter silence/deathcoil/pin? Would you call that balanced?

Of course not. You're missing the reasoning behind the whole nerf. And the reason for this is that you have a completely skewed vision of what PvP is. You probably have %%@*ty gear and play on a %%@*ty arena team if any at all.

You're major concern is about not dying in a BG where you can afk your way to free honor and get the gear you want. Whereas the people who are fighting for ratings that give them the best PvP gear have to deal with this stupid nonsense that is fear - stun spam and lose points/waste time to skilless scrubs who can kill something in FULL RESILIENCE with this kind of extended "stunlock", and I guarantee you that DK/Lock/Pal isn't the only comp that is capable of this, just the most scrub friendly and the current FOTM.

I think anyone can come up with a scenario where using some comp is going to allow a certain period of CC, you are suggesting the root cause of this is locks, no?
If a comp is going to be able to 'stun-lock' someone indefinitely until they are dead, that would have to have some real synergy and yes skill to do.

Durie

< Warpathetic >

Illidan

15. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:26:31 AM PDT

Q u o t e:
Let them hear it from you. Tell them exactly why Fear was nerfed. Please inform them that it is not meant to be part of a CC chain 20-30 seconds long with damage being spammed into them.

Tell them that Fear - Fear - Fear - Strangulate - HoJ - Gnaw - Fel hunter Silence is NOT balanced in arena.

Inform them of the difference between stuns for classes that require melee range and CC for ranged classes.

Please, so we can just end this nonsensical posting.

I think I see the problem there.

Pally + DK could probably 2v3 if they didn't have to face other pally + DK teams. This happened at the last arena tournament where the winning team played the blizz employees team 2v3 with warrior + druid (leaving their lock on the bench that time too).

Triq

Arena Tournament 1

16. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:33:25 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

I hear that having a rogue and mage/DK/Pally/Hunter/any class that deals damage while you're stunned by the rogue with CS/KS is OP... better nerf everyone...

Of course there are going to be OP combinations genius. Better just give us all a wet paper bag for armor and soggy piece of bread to beat each other with... that's the only way there won't ever be OP combinations of abilities.

Fear is used offensively by a lot of warlocks because it takes us 15+ seconds to deal the same amount of damage nearly every class can do to us in 3 seconds. Fix that imbalance and we won't have a problem.

Here's an idea, instead of relying on fear to do that damage. Rely on the ROGUE/DK/HUNTER/MAGE/PALLY/X whatever to do that damage. You're not there to get all the utility/damage/control yourself.

Thats why arenas are a group effort.
Thats why some classes have X utility and other classes have Y utility.
Thats why X + X sometimes becomes overpowered because its more than was intended.
Like Fear + Stuns.

Get the picture?

Triq

Arena Tournament 1

17. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:35:37 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

I think anyone can come up with a scenario where using some comp is going to allow a certain period of CC, you are suggesting the root cause of this is locks, no?
If a comp is going to be able to 'stun-lock' someone indefinitely until they are dead, that would have to have some real synergy and yes skill to do.

"I'm casting fear."
"Ok spamming Mutilate"
"Recastinf fear."
"Still spamming mutilate"
"Ok fear over."
"Aight I got vanish - CS - KS"
--Vanish - CS - K--- dead
"bleh didn't even get to use felhunter silence that game.

--PLayer on the recieving end
"%!#* THIS %@#% THIS GAME IS STUPID I DON'T GET TO MOVE AT ALL"

Oh sorry, thats in arenas where players doing that are REWARDED for it even in full resil gear.

Stop trying to convince yourself that my argument is flawed.

Omnimaru

Mok'Nathal

18. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:43:36 AM PDT

I'll be honest, and i mean no offense to GC, but i dont think he fully understands the issues locks are facing. Fear already has a plethora of ways to be broken, multiple times in fact, and they are further nerfing it? I dont understand this.

`~I hate Arena because I love PvP~`

Gutyu

The Venture Co

19. Re: Please clarify for the Warlocks GC. 03/28/2009 11:43:56 AM PDT

Q u o t e:

"I'm casting fear."
"Ok spamming Mutilate"
"Recastinf fear."
"Still spamming mutilate"
"Ok fear over."
"Aight I got vanish - CS - KS"
--Vanish - CS - K--- dead
"bleh didn't even get to use felhunter silence that game.

--PLayer on the recieving end
"%!#* THIS %@#% THIS GAME IS STUPID I DON'T GET TO MOVE AT ALL"

Oh sorry, thats in arenas where players doing that are REWARDED for it even in full resil gear.

Stop trying to convince yourself that my argument is flawed.

Replace fear with Counterspell and you are saying we should nerf mages?

CC is OP when you are using 1v2 and 1 v3 situations.

Please post careful responses, otherwise I will not even respond. I'll help you out a bit : I believe that theyare nerfing fear because ...

[ Post edited by Gutyu ]

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