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  • Malfurion
  • 600. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:10:11 PM PST
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Q u o t e:
SOMEONE SUGGESTED A CHANGE IN GENERAL AND IT WAS DONE REALLY QUICKLY.

I'M TAKING A SCREENSHOT TO SHOW MY FUTURE GRANDCHILDREN.


YOUR WELCOME
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  • 601. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:10:21 PM PST
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Q u o t e:
This was the wrong decision. People want their cake and want to eat it too. Easy epics. Superfast access to raid instances. No attunements. No needing to prove yourself before you can attempt the hardest content in the game.


Yeah, Coldbear. Because we all know that if you don't grab a rock in BRD, you can't cleansebot for MC.


Q u o t e:
Want to avoid all mobs and opposing-faction players? - Just get on your flying mount and jet away.


Oh no, people can avoid mobs and players that they don't want to have to bother killing in the world so they can get to where they can just get to where they want to go. The game is ruined for all the super skilled people that can prove themselves! Slap in the face!

I remember the days of vanilla WoW, aka the pure and perfect WoW for all the hardcore elites, when I had to do the horde onyxia attunment just to get to a mail box, every single time I wanted to. And then I had to do a timed crossword puzzle in Russian to click on it (the click ability lasted for 30 min), and then do a sudoku puzzle before I could open mail without an attachment, or translate Aramaic if the mail did have an attachment.

Those were they days when you had to actually earn everything in the game and prove yourself worthy of playing and checking mail. Approximately 78 percent of all the epicness is now gone from the entire game now that you can just walk up to a mailbox and take whatever you want from it, without actually earning the right to do it.


Q u o t e:
Want a motorcycle or a helicopter - here it is.


Oh man, more memories of vanilla wow. I remember I had to destroy and then put back together Azeroth for a mount after getting exalted and then hated with a city faction. Now, all these WotLK kiddies have their engineering motorcycles mailed to them -- and, again, they don't even have to do puzzles or know foreign and dead languages. Slap in the face!


Q u o t e:
Want to hang out in BGs or do ten arena games per week and get all kitted out in epics - no problem, this is the game for you.


I know, right! They should implement a rating system or something before you can get arena epics. I remember back in vanilla wow when I had to run a 3 min mile just to que up for arenas. And then in BC, I could sign up for a match any time I wanted and then study Latin (for when all guild names have to be in Latin and you have to take a Latin test before buying a charter and accepting an invite so it takes skill to be in a guild) while losing 10 games in a row to get epic season 3 shoulders at a rate of three per week.



Q u o t e:
Ok, guess you and the developers are gonna keep on catering to the lowest common denominator amongst your customers.


No, man! Resist! Refuse and resist! Don't give in to "the man!" Demand that they cater to the most high and glorious denominator! You know, all us vanilla WoW elites that want to spend $15 per day furiously engaged in doing trivial things before we can work at the game some more. Screw all the people that want to have fun and have to spend time away from the game for jobs and going out.


Q u o t e:
Can't please them all, and the majority of the kids that play these days want things to come easy, kinda like in Nintendo or your average first-person shooter game. Fast and easy. Quick groups and straight to the instance.


Oh man, don't you remember vanilla wow when you had to send an application in the mail before you could join a group? And then you had to show up for an interview and then do 45 pull ups in a minute? Those were the days. No one ever went into any of the instances, which was fine since obviously they were not ready to play this game. I mean, they don't even have super computers to process all of the keystrokes per second required to pull off a sunder armor or a greater heal. Amatures! And Blizzard wants to cater to them!


Q u o t e:
World pvp? Huh, no we don't like that. We like instant travel.


Oh man, do you remember in vanilla wow when you had to kill everyone in Org just so you could get from the starting zone to Goldshire? Those were the days, man! Now they've got mounts and flying mounts and flight paths and all that dooling idiot stuff. Any moron can hop on a bird, well, now that Blizzard has decided to cater to the mouth breathing idiot masses that only want to play the game without earning it.

But how many people can do what we elite super players can do and destroy all of the Titan pantheon while we walk from Stormwind to Scarlet Monstary and then back, all while wearing those electro-shock codpieces to prove our worth.


Q u o t e:
An immersive world were things seem vast, mystical and you feel like you're part of some great adventure - sorry, that's gonna have to take a backseat. More flashy graphic effects please, preferably so much that you can't even see the boss in a raidfight.


Oh man, I remember in vanilla WoW when you had to slay an actual boar at your desk every time you wanted to kill one for XP. Not only did you have to find a boar in real life, you had to capture it, get it to your desk and then kill it, and then send proof to Blizzard before they sent you a question written in Greek that you had to answer correctly in order to unlock the ability to kill a boar. A single boar! That was skill and immersion right there.


Q u o t e:
Aggro too hard for you? Ok, we'll just dramatically up the threat generation of ALL tanks across the board to make sure you don't really need to be a good player to get to endgame raidcontent.


Yeah man, I remember back in Vanilla wow when pallies had Blessing of Salvation and it only lasted 5 min, and there were no greater blessings so you had to buff every single person individually, and raids were 40-man which meant they were harder and required more skill. Those were the days. Some people were like "this is really inconvenient." But what they really meant was that buffing all those people every 5 min took too much skill and they couldn't handle it. They didn't have the IQs and typing speed to get it done. They lacked elite player skills and wanted everything dumbed down.

So they took away Blessing of Salvation and that one totem and then just made all the tanks generate more aggro to make up the difference. Otherwise groups with no pally or shaman would be at a noticable disadvantage. And that's why the game sucks, now, because pallies and shamans aren't required for everything anymore. And pallies don't have to buff every 5 minutes.

Boo hoo. The game took skill. Go cry to your teachers for not training you for the mature and skill demanding game that WoW used to be.

Boredom during raids + Lv. 70 Paladin = Pally Ability and Talent Ideas: http://www.war-tools.com/t55109.html?b=9zyxt
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  • 602. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:10:29 PM PST
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Q u o t e:


It was left in long enough(unpunished) that if Blizzard approached it like a cheat at this point, it would be met with nothing short of outrage in all liklihood. A "cheat" not punished is a bypass. Changing the terms around to make it seem criminal-like in behavior does not change how it is viewed when no counter-measure is taken for so long.


I believe your logic is still flawed.

If you exploit a game mechanic to give you an advantage above the norm, it is still cheating the system.

People knew they were exploiting it.

Grand Marshal of the Alliance Forces
I have NEVER followed the path of Shadow, always the Light.
"At times it's just popular to hate things that are popular" - Blizz
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  • 603. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:11:37 PM PST
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Q u o t e:


So if we exploit something long enough in game they will cave in and make it part of the regular game mechanics? Nice, lets exploit getting into Old Ironforge enough that they open it up to us all.


My simplifying what was said does not mean:

-I say what I do having any power over Blizzard's policy enforcement or the like, meaning what is said is based on personal and semi-experienced opinion.

-It is well known that the ghetto-hearth method was entirely unintended from the get go. It wasn't punished, but it wasn't meant to be used on such a wide scale. It was meant as a way to keep people from forcing place-holders in instances as well as to keep them from griefing a group for a prolonged period in an instance.

Don't misinterpret what I'm saying and seek to break existing policies for the sake of this matter, if you're looking at it in that light, then you will not win out on anything. I'll say again, that it was "exploited" but NOT "punished".
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  • Dreadmaul
  • 604. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:12:43 PM PST
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So i boot an afker from our group...his hearth is on cd....and now what? or is he still gonna get ghetto hearthed?

Edit: i found my answer xD <3 world of raids

[ Post edited by Meatntatoes ]


(>'-')> Q('-'Q)
(>0.0)> o--(>-<Q)
*poof* O--(0.oQ)
*po O--(^.^Q)
<(X_x)> (Q'-')Q Vanish: Working as Intended.
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  • 605. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:15:00 PM PST
quote locked

Q u o t e:
So i boot an afker from our group...his hearth is on cd....and now what? or is he still gonna get ghetto hearthed?

If you are serious, a part of me just died.
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  • 606. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:15:14 PM PST
quote locked

Q u o t e:


I believe your logic is still flawed.

If you exploit a game mechanic to give you an advantage above the norm, it is still cheating the system.

People knew they were exploiting it.


If my logic is still flawed you're more than welcome to suggest to Blizzard through the appropriate channels, that they should make a means to track "Ghetto Hearths" and punish anyone who uses it as such accordingly. Simply saying what you did for the sake of saying it won't change policies or the like, and while an opinion is great, feedback that may be used to approach actual changes is going to generally be more useful than simply saying:

"So you let cheats and criminals get away with it and don't punish them because the HS is now on a 30 minute timer then as 'punishment'. Ok." That's your statement in a nutshell, do tell, what useful purpose does that state other than to indirectly flame the company and their decisions to make things a little better for the average player?

Or, better yet, if you can tell me honestly you've never used a "Ghetto Hearth", I'll take your point as non-hypocritical.
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  • 607. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:15:30 PM PST
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Q u o t e:
You know, there was a time before "ghetto hearthing" was possible and you had to rely on your hearthstone cooldown, or a mage port. I know it's crazy to even try and imagine such harsh living conditions.

I will tell you what, guys. I'll bring this up with the designers. Though the hearthstone is reasonable, since many of you have become used to "ghetto hearth" style travel, it may be deemed an appropriate change.

I can make no promises.

Update: Alright, all -- we're going to make the cooldown on hearthstones 30 minutes when 3.1.0 releases. Enjoy your sweet victory.

Thanks to those who provided feedback constructively.


It has probably been said already. The funny thing with his first post was how wrong he was. There was "unstuck" option which would give 2 or 3 "ghetto hearths" so you could basically hearth every 4 times an hour in vanilla wow..

30 mins seems fair. For non shaman and mages 1hr was painful.
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  • Altar of Storms
  • 608. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:17:34 PM PST
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So what change is going in that makes leaving a party not send you back to your bound location? I really liked the ability to kick someone out of my party while doing a heroic or a raid knowing they would be out of my instance within a minute instead of just standing there and taking up a spot because they're mad I removed them from the party.

What happens when I remove someone from my party now?
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  • 609. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:19:21 PM PST
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Q u o t e:
So what change is going in that makes leaving a party not send you back to your bound location? I really liked the ability to kick someone out of my party while doing a heroic or a raid knowing they would be out of my instance within a minute instead of just standing there and taking up a spot because they're mad I removed them from the party.

What happens when I remove someone from my party now?


They get thrown to the nearest graveyard I believe.
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  • 610. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:19:28 PM PST
quote locked

Q u o t e:
So what change is going in that makes leaving a party not send you back to your bound location? I really liked the ability to kick someone out of my party while doing a heroic or a raid knowing they would be out of my instance within a minute instead of just standing there and taking up a spot because they're mad I removed them from the party.

What happens when I remove someone from my party now?


I am guessing they get ported to the GRAVEYARD like it says..
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  • 611. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:19:37 PM PST
quote locked

Q u o t e:
So what change is going in that makes leaving a party not send you back to your bound location? I really liked the ability to kick someone out of my party while doing a heroic or a raid knowing they would be out of my instance within a minute instead of just standing there and taking up a spot because they're mad I removed them from the party.

What happens when I remove someone from my party now?


they will go back to the closest graveyard from where they entered the instance/BG

= Magebleck
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Eyonix
Blizzard Poster
  • 612. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:22:41 PM PST
quote locked

Q u o t e:


It has probably been said already. The funny thing with his first post was how wrong he was. There was "unstuck" option which would give 2 or 3 "ghetto hearths" so you could basically hearth every 4 times an hour in vanilla wow..

30 mins seems fair. For non shaman and mages 1hr was painful.


Actually, there was a time before "unstuck" worked as you've described. As much as it's exciting for people to see me make mistakes, be wrong, or just plain fail -- there was a time when the hearthstone was the only way to "hearth".
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  • 613. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:24:25 PM PST
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Q u o t e:
People complain too much. If you want to be able to port all over ROLL A MAGE!

Just because people got use to exploiting Instances and BGs to get what they want doesnt mean you conform to them.

I have toons that are not mages and you know how I get around? I either mount up and move or I pay a mage to port me. If you use up your herth and need to get somwhere... Do it yourself. Dont start complaining and !@@*@ing to Bliz.

Blizzard is really letting me down by giving in to the QQrs. It truly sadens me and makes me fear for the future of this game if they are going to just give in to peoples complaints.


While it is kind of sad to see Blizzard giving in to the QQ, personally I am in favor of the change.

As far as I'm concerned it's win-win. My non-mage alts can get around faster, while in turn I don't have to put up with port requests any more. Plus, I used to carry around a stack of teleport runes and a stack of portal runes; this will free up a bag slot as I ditch the portal runes. Two if I ditch my hearthstone. Three if Blizzard would ditch the reagent cost for teleport.

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  • 614. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:25:51 PM PST
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Stop caving in to the QQ. Leave it at one hour. I am sick of the QQ'ers as Eyonix is. Too bad the devs were the ones that started this new trend anyway by catering to the casuals.

Be careful what you wish for because you might just get it.

[ Post edited by Riusaki ]


All Classes are created equal. But some classes are more equal than others.
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  • Bleeding Hollow
  • 615. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:26:24 PM PST
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Thank you!
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  • Kael'thas
  • 617. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:27:46 PM PST
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Q u o t e:


Actually, there was a time before "unstuck" worked as you've described. As much as it's exciting for people to see me make mistakes, be wrong, or just plain fail -- there was a time when the hearthstone was the only way to "hearth".



Lil red dragon buddy, this whole hearth CD changing development has me curious. Are any other "hearth type" abilities/items also having their CDs tweaked, engineering teleporters for example? Not QQ about their CDs. All these hearthstone topics makes me wonder about the other abilities.

--Your decision making skills need a buff.--
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  • 618. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:28:14 PM PST
quote locked

Q u o t e:


While it is kind of sad to see Blizzard giving in to the QQ, personally I am in favor of the change.

As far as I'm concerned it's win-win. My non-mage alts can get around faster, while in turn I don't have to put up with port requests any more. Plus, I used to carry around a stack of teleport runes and a stack of portal runes; this will free up a bag slot as I ditch the portal runes. Two if I ditch my hearthstone. Three if Blizzard would ditch the reagent cost for teleport.




It wasn't a matter of QQ, as Eyonix stated previously in the thread. It always will appear that way because most people find these spots by going to places like the sites that track Blizzard Staff posts, without reading the thread in the entirety. Eyonix made mention that constructive posts/feedback is what was mostly relayed(under my assumption a bit), and it wasn't just mindless complaining that made this change be considered, it was a multitude of factors based on earnest and true to the point player feedback, as well as what Eyonix himself has stated earlier.

I implore future posters to please give consideration to reading the entire topic and it's individual replies before adding in their two cents to save from this confusion in the future.

[ Post edited by Milea ]

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  • 619. Re: Change Hearthstones to 30 Minutes.   02/26/2009 09:31:36 PM PST
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The issue of "ghetto hearth" comes into my gameplay during PUG runs. There is nothing worse than hearthing to Dalaran from Ogrimmar (which is the fastest town to get to an auction house from the portal trainer) and then traveling to some instance, only for the party to break up in 10 minutes because.....well, strangers on the internet are strangers on the internet.

This is where "ghetto hearthing" comes into play for me. No more of my time need be wasted because of random puggers. I can go right back to Dalaran and do something else, like query for BGs.

I mean, let's think of the alternative:

Is it a productive use of my time and gold to spam the local channel seeking a mage to port me to Dalaran? Especially when any Mage in the area is probably too low lv to have a port to Dalaran?

No, not really. It's much simpler to just let the instance kick me back to Dalaran.


Sure, I could fly back to Dalaran, but why do so? That takes longer, and it's boring. In fact, when I'm flying anywhere I'm AFK most of the time as I alt tab to read something or go get a sandwich. Once you are high enough in the sky, you basically just set yourself to auto-run and you'll be there, well, whenever you get there.


I suppose the reason players are confused about the removal of ghetto hearth is because it's been in the game forever, and removing it is just adding a complexity that really doesn't need to be there.

Does forcing me to fly back to Dalaran after a failed pug run improve gameplay in any way? All I see it doing is making me more angry.

[ Post edited by Morglaif ]


Unholy / Blood DPS Pre-Raid Gearing Guide

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=13909408581&sid=1
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