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Q u o t e:
since you guys already have the emblem of valor trading for emblem of heroism.
can we please have it the other way too?

I wouldn't mind if you have it like 2 or 5 or 10 emblems of heroism for 1 emblems of valor.

I don't really have time to raid all the 25man contents per week to get the emblems of valor.

blizz can you please consider this.

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Its obvious why they let you downgrade, and its even more obvious why you cant trade lower rating badges for higher. Either way tho, if you arent doing valor instances, why do you need 213 gear?

I'm perfectly fine with the Multi-Token system

If blizzard allows you to trade EoH for EoV than many players out there will start bragging about pugging 25 mans, end up getting invited to 25 man raids which they know nothing about and then piss off the groups, Everyone complains Blizzard takes an extended vacation for a while to shut people off.

Come on guys what more could you want they are makeing this game EZ mode for you guys yet you still complain!

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Q u o t e:
since you guys already have the emblem of valor trading for emblem of heroism.
can we please have it the other way too?

I wouldn't mind if you have it like 2 or 5 or 10 emblems of heroism for 1 emblems of valor.

I don't really have time to raid all the 25man contents per week to get the emblems of valor.

blizz can you please consider this.

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TLDR:
No
No one cares
No one cares
No

Long:
If you don't do 25men raid, you dont get the 25men loot.
Just that simple.

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Q u o t e:


Apples and oranges.

Oh and kill yourself too you fail at any remote amounts of logic.

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Wait so your allowed to trade apples for oranges but not oranges for apples.

His analogy was validated by blizzard allowing the Valor for heroic trade. They essentially put a common value on the two items.

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Q u o t e:
Long:
If you don't do 25men raid, you dont get the 25men loot.
Just that simple.

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You could also argue that if you don't do 10 mans you shouldn't get 10 man loot either.

Also Bornak if you feel the two loot progression model was so important why are you allowing 25 man players access to the 10 man loot without running the content?

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Q u o t e:


Wait so your allowed to trade apples for oranges but not oranges for apples.

His analogy was validated by blizzard allowing the Valor for heroic trade. They essentially put a common value on the two items.



You could also argue that if you don't do 10 mans you shouldn't get 10 man loot either.

Also Bornak if you feel the two loot progression model was so important why are you allowing 25 man players access to the 10 man loot without running the content?

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You were one of those @!#*s in undergrad who asked questions when the professors would ask at an end of day class and everyone just wanted to leave, huh?

Because the 25 man loot is better. They are allowing you to trade your good 25 man Naxx/10 Man Ulduar badges that buy better loot for worse 10 man Naxx/heroic badges that buy inferior albeit different loot. Just as you'll eventually be able to trade your even better 25 man Ulduar badges for the good but by then worse 25 Naxx/10 Ulduar ones. It exists in order to force people to progress if they want better loot rather than being able to farm early content for end game gear, which would end up causing some raids to become irrelevant like what happened to SSC/TK in BC and allow guilds that have no right to step into high end content to do it anyways. Just like BC. It's a very simple, easy to grasp concept that shouldn't be eluding anybody.

You can make the trade ratio from Heroism Emblems to Valourous Emblems as awful as you want, but the point remains that if you do that people will be able to get T8 gear (and in the future, T9) without ever actually having to set foot in a T8 or T9 raid. And it'll undoubtedly be terribad players who can't handle T8/T9 content but feel entitled to their loot anyway who will be doing it. You may think that's a good idea. If you do, congratulations, you're an idiot.

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Q u o t e:
Please do add other things to buy with heroism though. It would be nice if good tanks and healers still ran heroics for some kind of reward, gems from heroism were a good step.

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the whole purpose of graduating to raid instances, particularly 25 mans, is so you DONT EVER HAVE TO SET FOOT in a stupid 5 man ever again

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Q u o t e:


Good thing this game is bursting at the seams with raid content eh.

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This one time I did the regs then raids then bc then regs then heroics then wotlk then regs then heroics then raids then rolled an alt then did the regs then heroics now raids.

Good thing I'll never have to do heroics ever again, right?

At first I was fine with the multiple badge system, but admittedly, the lack of incentive to go into a 5man is making this game a little on the boring side. All the rep grinds I wanted to do are done. All the badge gear from heroism badges have been purchased.

Yeah, I raid....1 night we do OS/VOA 25man...then I go to sleep cuz I don't feel like doing a heroic that offers me absolutely nothing.

A couple nights of Naxx 25...maybe I get an upgrade, maybe I don't....there's at least a chance and some valor tokens to boot.

Guild will run Naxx10, but what's the point. Nothing in there I really need and the tokens don't offer me anything.

At least in BC, the tokens could be accumulated for something. It may have taken 300+ tokens to get all the items what I wanted, but at least they were actual upgrades and gave me something to work towards. If noting was happening, I could go run heroics. Kara was a badge pinata.

There was a reason to go back, even if we outgeared the places. The side benefit was that less geared players could come along and get geared up.

All in all...I prefer the BC way. More gear was added over time and always a step or two behind the raids. For nonraiders, it was a way to feel like you were progressing (even if you never did actually use the gear to go into a higher raid). For casual raiders, it prevented you from being left in the dust by guildies.

Edit: slightly clarified something

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Q u o t e:


I hear being able to trade 100 dollar bills in for a Benjamin defeats the entire points of the monetary system.

I mean after all if you can only earn dollar bills from tips, you should never get access to hundred-dollar bills since they're obviously too high-class for you.

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That analogy doesn't work in the least.

5-man heroics in wrath are ridiculously easy, get a pally, consecrate + AOE every single pull. Being able to buy raid gear with those tokens would be stupid.

However, maybe Blizzard could add some BoP recipes for crafting professions (tailoring. /stare) that use more frozen orbs. That would make running heroics worthwhile.

Any plans to add new items for Stone Shards or WG marks?

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Q u o t e:

With 3.1 please let us by helm and other tier gear using tokens. Or something besides boots and belts - like upgraded honor token gear or something.

I know lots of people with nothing to spend valour tokens on. We need more options - it'd be nice to get something for all of them.

It's sad when people convert valour tokens to honor tokens to buy a mount.

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Heavens no.

What next? The entire Tier 7 available by running Heroic PuGs?

Might as well skip Naxx 10/25 completely.

There should be an end to farming these Emblems. I have no intention of farming 4,000+ Emblems of Heroism to buy all of the excess gear that is available and then some.

I'm glad Blizzard only put so much there and nothing else. Once you get all of the Heirloom gear and all of your Badge gear, you should move on to other things. I do want to complete my Achievements one of these days for the next 2 years.......

Bornakk will you be able to buy Tier 8 (tokens that drop from 10-man Ulduar) with Emblems of Valor?

Sort of like how you can buy Tier 7 (not Tier 7.5) with Emblems of Heroism that drop from 10-man Naxx, Eye of Eternity and Sarth.

Or will Tier 8 only drop from Ulduar 10 (assuming Tier 8.5 only drops from 25-man Ulduar)