Crappy and useless sigil. Should have been:

You generate 1 RP every time you dodge or parry an attack.

or

Reduces the RP cost or runestrike by 5.

or

You generate 15% additional threat from all attacks while all your runes are on CD.

or

well pretty much anything is better than what we got...

ITT DKs complain about getting a quality tanking sigil that gives them avoidance.

Scuttlebut is its a 100% chance to procc with a 30 second uptime.

I'm not miffed about it anymore.

The def will help make IBF better... but what I don't get is why it is so low a value on a chance. Unless it procs all the time and is able to stay up 100% of the time it should be a much higher value.

53 Def Rating = 10.78 Def which would be about 1.2% more mitigation from IBF while the proc is up and only 0.4% more parry/dodge/miss. These values don't seem to make up the lack of stats that a ranged slot tanking item would have.

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Q u o t e:
53 Def Rating = 10.78 Def which would be about 1.2% more mitigation from IBF while the proc is up and only 0.4% more parry/dodge/miss. These values don't seem to make up the lack of stats that a ranged slot tanking item would have.

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so the vast majority of dk tanks will be trading a sigil that gives a minor buff to blood strike (oh so useful for tanking...) for something that gives a slight boost to IBF and ~1.2% total avoidance?

Not great but not bad.

Keep in mind pally tank librams for tanking at 70 were either the badge libram (~5.3% more block with holy shield up... which isn't total avoidance) or something with BV out of black temple. Now at 80 we have a BV libram or... the same libram that now gives less than 3% block.

For trash maybe 5.3% block is better than 1.2% total avoidance... but for bosses i'm not so sure. It'll definately take some more testing and number tweaking but, again, its a test realm. And if nothing else its a helluva lot better than the same sigil you get out of your starting questline for tanking *shrug*

Personally, I just want something epic and high enough ilvl so that I can get the achievement... w/o buying the item JUST for the achievement. :/

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Q u o t e:
This sigil is specifically for death knights who have trouble reaching the 540 "cap." Because it is reliable, you aren't depending on a random roll to keep your defense high. If you don't like having to use Icy Touch (or whatever) to keep your defense high, then this sigil isn't for you. There are other options though.

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No there aren't. And 53 def is crap even with a 100% up time. If a tanking gun was released with 53 def rating on it the warriors would laugh. How can you even possibly think this relic is good in anyway?

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Q u o t e:


No there aren't. And 53 def is crap even with a 100% up time. If a tanking gun was released with 53 def rating on it the warriors would laugh. How can you even possibly think this relic is good in anyway?

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Hold on here, what's wrong with 53 defense rating? Would you rather your scourge strikes do extra damage?

53 Def rating is not bad for a ranged slot... the best tanking gun is:

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41168
Armor Plated Combat Shotgun
Binds when equipped
Ranged Gun
181 - 337 Damage Speed 2.00
(129.5 damage per second)
+42 Stamina
Blue Socket
Socket Bonus: +6 Stamina
Durability 90 / 90
Requires Level 80
Equip: Increases defense rating by 21 (4.27 @ L80).
Equip: Improves hit rating by 18 (0.55% @ L80).

Which can get 37 def rating max(w/o JCing BoP gem)... BUT it also has hit and stam on it, which I would like to see those stat values morphed into def rating for the sigil. Im guessing somewhere closer to 70 Def rating.

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Q u o t e:


Hold on here, what's wrong with 53 defense rating? Would you rather your scourge strikes do extra damage?

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Crappy and useless sigil. Should have been:

You generate 1 RP every time you dodge or parry an attack.
or
Reduces the RP cost or runestrike by 5.
or
You generate 15% additional threat from all attacks while all your runes are on CD.
or
just let me use: http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41168
or
well pretty much anything is better than what we got...

I mean, additional damage to SS is probably better (due to threat gen) if your specced for SS.

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Q u o t e:


No there aren't. And 53 def is crap even with a 100% up time. If a tanking gun was released with 53 def rating on it the warriors would laugh. How can you even possibly think this relic is good in anyway?

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relic slots have never been equal to real ranged weapon slots. Why should DKs have it any better? The sigil is fine. If you still don't like it, you can use a "threat" sigil instead.

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Q u o t e:
No there aren't. And 53 def is crap even with a 100% up time. If a tanking gun was released with 53 def rating on it the warriors would laugh. How can you even possibly think this relic is good in anyway?

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Oranges v Apples

A Warrior isn't lacking +Def options as badly as a DK. This sigil covers the slot DKs are weak at the most in fresh 80 gear and can fill in to keep uncrittable when epics downrate on +Def rating. If you don't like it, don't use it.

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Q u o t e:

Oranges v Apples

A Warrior isn't lacking +Def options as badly as a DK. This sigil covers the slot DKs are weak at the most in fresh 80 gear and can fill in to keep uncrittable when epics downrate on +Def rating. If you don't like it, don't use it.

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What else should I use in its place for tanking?? Thats right, there isn't anything. Every DK will tank with it cause there's nothing else.

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Q u o t e:


What else should I use in its place for tanking?? Thats right, there isn't anything. Every DK will tank with it cause there's nothing else.

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At least it's not bad. It has a 100% uptime. If it was an Idol of Terror type thing, THEN it would be bad. We should expect to see more tanking relics as more content is released this time around, too.

... Right Ghostcrawler?

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Q u o t e:
This sigil is specifically for death knights who have trouble reaching the 540 "cap." Because it is reliable, you aren't depending on a random roll to keep your defense high. If you don't like having to use Icy Touch (or whatever) to keep your defense high, then this sigil isn't for you. There are other options though.

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Unless it's _EVERY SINGLE_ Icy Touch, which the tooltip says 'chance,' then it's worthless. Procs are bad for defense for the "Oops, i got critted because my sigil didn't proc!" scenario. If the proc was dodge or parry, it'd be okay. Defense not so much.... esp. since you think we should use it to help hit the cap. :\

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Q u o t e:


What else should I use in its place for tanking?? Thats right, there isn't anything. Every DK will tank with it cause there's nothing else.

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Can somebody do an effective health comparison between the Armor Plated Shotgun (assume a 24 stam gem in it) and this sigil assuming the 53 def rating is always active?

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Q u o t e:


Unless it's _EVERY SINGLE_ Icy Touch, which the tooltip says 'chance,' then it's worthless. Procs are bad for defense for the "Oops, i got critted because my sigil didn't proc!" scenario. If the proc was dodge or parry, it'd be okay. Defense not so much.... esp. since you think we should use it to help hit the cap. :\

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Please read. It's a 100% chance.

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Q u o t e:
Please read. It's a 100% chance.

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If it is, I'll shut up and just say 'tool tips are misleading.'

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Q u o t e:


At least it's not bad. It has a 100% uptime. If it was an Idol of Terror type thing, THEN it would be bad. We should expect to see more tanking relics as more content is released this time around, too.

... Right Ghostcrawler?

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Lol.. like druid idols right? Cause they have lots of useful choices now...

I don't understand how you guys just believe anything these guys say. Look at how things have gone over the past 4 years. Every now and then they jump on the boards and spew out these things like somehow they've realized their mistakes, and its a work in progress, and blah blah blah... They've been doing that for the past 4 years. Remember how druid itemization was gonna be all reworked, ect... for TBC, and that was a complete and utter failure. Now were heading for round 2 but this time the writing on the wall is for DKs.