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Q u o t e:
If they're finding what they're designed to do boring, they should pick another class. This is like complaining that your Mage sucks at melee.

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Tell ya what.

Have the dev tell us WHICH spell all the healers are supposed to be based on. Single target or Aoe. No middle choice, no little of each. If paladins HAVE to be one category then everyone else should be too.

Then have them remove EVERY single other type of healing spells. Priests are good aoe healers? Remove their single target heals or make them crappy beyond word. Druids are meant to be hot's healers? Remove their aoe and single target direct heals. Shamans chain healing is uber? Remove all their single target heals.

See, this is what I call fairness. You either make EVERYONE be able to do each role in a different proportion, or you have everyone do ONE thing. We call that fairness. Something most priests, shamans and druids don't seem to understand.

The thing is, I raided as a holy paladin for a long time, but gave it up. Played different alts for a while, have a rogue at 70 and raided for a while on that toon. Ultimately wanted to get back into healing, but just didn't want to spend all of my time spamming FoL, so I leveled this guy. Now I'd contend that a good healer can be good on any class, once they learn the mechanics of the class, as the things that make a healer good have to do with situational awareness, knowing how to react properly, being proactive when possible, and being able to triage on the fly (keeping up the players most important to being able to win the encounter). The thing is, you will always be better with better tools. As a paladin healer, what you had to work with was 2 heals, a really crappy instant heal, and mana efficiency. This has improved somewhat, with beacon and some optional stuff that can be done with glyphs, but all in all, the toolbox is still pretty lacking.

As it stands, there just doesn't seem to be much in the way of incentive, if you want to be a healer, to be a paladin healer. So you have people with level 70 paladins, that want to heal, want to be good at it, but lack the tools that every other healing class has. Choices are abandon the paladin and roll another class (what I did), or let the devs know what you think is needed to be an effective healer.

TLDR; paladins are @!@@%ing about their healing spec because it's pretty lacking.

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Q u o t e:
If they're finding what they're designed to do boring, they should pick another class. This is like complaining that your Mage sucks at melee.

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From the posts I'm reading, they're more concerned about their solo dps than bored with their class. I was stating my opinion - I find one/two button healing boring and would gouge my eyes out if I had to do it for long. The solo dps problem fixer is apparently in the works in a future patch coming "soon," but that won't stop players from posting about ways that may or may not solve things.

The system of judging to receive spell haste is also questionable, according to some. Posting about this measure could garner some better ideas and maybe even cause change.

And I've read a few odd posts about the glyph of holy light which may or may not be good or bad.

Lastly, there's always the ever present post about changes to bacon (beacon) of light.

Ah but you forgot to mention the magic word r-tard.

4 DIRECT single target heals.

Would you argue that's exactly what all other healing classes have or would you finally admit they actually have heals for different purposes?

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Q u o t e:

Of course they have heals for other purposes. Guess how many they actually use in a raid, on any given fight? Four or so, sometimes less.

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I've got five that I use with regularity, not counting reactive abilities and totems :X

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Q u o t e:
And what certain paladins don't seem to get is that raiding as any of these other healers isn't seriously more interactive than Paladins at 80. Four heals, plus judging, plus CD/Mana management stuff. That's what your play is like now, and about what any healer's play is like.

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I disagree. More options and finer control of the healing means that a a priest CAN be more interactive and and this leads to more complex play. If you aren't using all of the tools at your disposal, that doesn't mean that you are just like a paladin, it means that you are choosing to simplify things. That's fine if it's what you want, but I don't see how you can argue against giving another healing class some of the options that you have just because you choose not to use them.

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Q u o t e:
Ah but you forgot to mention the magic word r-tard.

4 DIRECT single target heals.

Would you argue that's exactly what all other healing classes have or would you finally admit they actually have heals for different purposes?

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man, L2P. get the FoL glpyh HoT. tis the beastliest thing i ever chose for my holy pally

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Q u o t e:
But that's what they're designed to do, and what they excel at.

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Except that in today's raid design single target healing just doesn't cut it anymore.

It requires the intelligent selection of a target actively taking damage and selecting the appropriate heal to use to balance the required need between max HPS and efficiency.

I really liked this and enjoyed pally healing.

We used to do this by using a variety of down ranked holy lights to keep the raid alive and by having encounters which didn’t focus on healing everyone at once.

Now we have a huge mana inefficient heal, an instant heal on a 6 sec CD and a small mana efficient heal.


The problem is unless Blizzard gives all healing classes the required tools for most situations, Blizzard is really shooting themselves in the foot.

Having an unbalanced class system by design means you need to put a lot more effort into balanced encounter design.

This is a lot harder to achieve than class balance imo.

Don’t get me wrong Odes, I can understand your concern and why throughout these boards your really trying to stop paladins from having a complete tool set.

Main comparison : Priest v Paladin

Paladin has better single target heals:

Throughout the lower tiers of TBC raid damage was mainly single target damage that favored the selection of the target taking damage and healing them. As paladins surpassed priests in this department, priests were often left out due to them simply not being as good as paladins.

Priests are decent (currently the best, but judgement is still out on what will become of CoH) AoE healers.

Blizzard recognized the fact that paladins dominated single target healing fights and introduced ever more heavy AoE damage fights specifically targeted towards the paladins weakness. Unfortunately, we don’t have any tools to combat this what so ever and paladins were the ones left out.

The only way for paladins and priests to remain competitive towards each other with the current tool set is by having encounters perfectly balanced between strong single target damage and aoe. Otherwise it will always favor one over the other.

Only by having all healing classes homogenized far enough as to every healer can heal every situation can you finally start building epic encounters.

This is the same reason they had to homogenize tanks. It makes encounter balance really hard if you have one type of tank totally dominate some fights but completely lack in others. (Single target v Aoe)

Let me re-iterate. We are happy for priests to get better single target/ours to get nerfed. We simply want to be able to heal every encounter as effectively as other classes.

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Q u o t e:
Ah but you forgot to mention the magic word r-tard.

4 DIRECT single target heals.

Would you argue that's exactly what all other healing classes have or would you finally admit they actually have heals for different purposes?

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How eloquent and classy, I really wonder why people are annoyed by Paladin's posting!

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Q u o t e:


Yup our boards are by far the most civil class forums of them all, sucks blizz is only going to look at the class role forums since all that goes on here is QQ.

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They never* looked at the priest boards anyway, or if they did, they never* posted, or if they posted, it never* generated meaningful dialog, so the net effect of the new Class Role boards are exactly the same on Priests.

Just my opinion of course.

*Hyperbole, in case you missed it.

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Q u o t e:


Sigh.

Beacon's throughput to the recipient scales negatively with the avoidance of the target you are currently healing - the more they avoid, the less throughput that Beacon provides. Similarly, it also scales negatively with the mitigation value of that target.

Beacon's effectiveness scales negatively with the avoidance of the recipient of the Beacon - the more avoidance they have, the less likely it is at any given time that the heal transmitted by the Beacon will be completely utilised. Similarly it also scales negatively with their mitigation.

What this means is that if either the person you are healing or the person with Beacon on them have avoidance strings, proc mitigation abilities or are topped off by another healer then Beacon operates at lower effectiveness.

It's not just heal sniping that ruins Beacon, as your tank gets better gear, Beacon gets worse.

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and that is the reason smart pallies dont like bacon of light it cant even be used well in 5 mans and scales dow from there because of better gear, more people, and the stupid range problem it has

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Q u o t e:
This might matter if a) only one of your tanks ever got better gear,

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1. Most progression guilds gear up a preferred MT first
2. As tank avoidance increases, the probability of tanks taking identical damage decreases

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Q u o t e:
b) you couldn't switch targets and heal your secondary/tertiary tank when your first was taking less damage,

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Those other targets have their own healers assigned to them which means that any healing put into them is likely to be sniped and will thus not get passed on to the Beacon target.

Furthermore, tank HP fluctuates on timescales of around 1-3 GCDs. Switching targets is a poor way of coping with that scenario.

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Q u o t e:
and c) if you didn't have sacred shield to level things out on one of your targets.

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Sacred Shield is a mitigation effect that scales inversely with the recipient's avoidance because it requires them to take damage before the shield will activate.

You haven't theorycrafted Paladin healing at all have you or played one at the high end of raiding?

Oh, hai GC.

Thanks for dropping in and saying hello :).