Elemental shaman need some love in PvP. When we are focused we can't do anything (well we are always focused first, because we have no defense and people know it).

Once we are counter spell, we cannot heal, we cannot dps, we cannot run away (ghostwolf is also nature) for 8 second.

Thunderstorm does not work most of the time in PVP (do the dmg, but no the pushback). And even when it pushback, most class that we want to pushback come back in instantly to us (intercep, shadowstep).

Most class, if not all, can beat us in 1v1 without even trying hard if they have similar gear. I know this game is not balanced for 1v1, but is it expected that we are so bad in PVP? Why blizzard have buff mage vs warlock if this game is not balanced for 1v1? Can we have a chance to beat some class?

Here some PvP suggestions.

1: Make Ghost Wolf physical, so we can cast it when counterspell and it don't get dispel when we try to run away. This will help alot with shaman defense.

2: Add a 2 sec stun effect to ThunderStorm so the target don't instantly come back to us. And lower the cooldown to 30 second. After all its a 51 point talent.

3: Add an instant fire spell that have no cooldown. Maybe it could do more damage when the target have flame shock debuff. This will help us when we are moving, when we are counterspell. Also on nature immune mob/boss. We need something to cast between lava burst cooldown.

4: Change hex to be 36 yard range talented with a 30 second cooldown. 45 second cooldown is too long for PvP and PvE, and why is it 20 yard? It have 1.5 second cast, have a long cooldown, the target can move while hexed. There no reason to make the range that low.

Since last patch, most class destroy me in PvP, its not even funny. When I thunderstorm a melee, I don't even have time to cast a CL before he come back.

Also remember, in arena, most team say focus the shaman first, there a reason for that... we are free kill.

Note: English is not my main language. And for armory fan, I may not have all my PvP gear on.

TY

---

Q u o t e:

I play a druid. I play a shaman too. Elemental in fact. ;p I have many more. I don’t usually talk about my characters. I love them all as much as many of you probably love your characters.

---

Woot for having a %@*!ton of characters and no life :P. Its an exclusive club, haha

---

Q u o t e:

I play a druid. I play a shaman too. Elemental in fact. ;p I have many more. I don’t usually talk about my characters. I love them all as much as many of you probably love your characters.

---

Interesting. I'd be curious to hear what you think of them in PvP.

---

Q u o t e:


You just become my personal hero with that post GC. However, don't take it the wrong way when we hold you accountable for that as I'm putting that quote directly into my sig with today's date on it. I'll remove that from my sig the day you announce our fix. Hopefully that isn't months from now. I'll have some faith for the time being.

---

"I know you've repeatedly said how much you hate it when people assume you make promises but I'm TOTALLY GONNA HOLD YOU TO THIS RANDOM THING AND THEN WHINE WHEN I DON'T GET EXACTLY WHAT I WANT, thereby making you never, ever want to talk about future changes"

Shut up. This is exactly what causes us to NOT get any future changes because nothing is set in stone in a game like this.

---

Q u o t e:
I play a druid. I play a shaman too. Elemental in fact. ;p I have many more. I don’t usually talk about my characters. I love them all as much as many of you probably love your characters.

---

For the love of all that is holy, PLEASE tell us you at least played 10 games a week with your ELE shaman in arena.

I could care less about rating...all you have to do is step inside an arena 10 times a week and you will have a FULL understanding of ELE shaman issues.

(Not that you'll respond to this, and this is no insult to you)

But every time I see and Kill and ELE shaman with my new DK, I hope it is you. I hope you play on my server. Cuz if I make your life a living hell....well who knows.....you might get your exodus friends to kill me.

---

Q u o t e:
We’d like to give Elemental either a talent that converts Int to spell power or gives a better spell power to damage conversion (or both).

---

I really hope the latter winners over the former. Bringing DPS up to par with more spell power is perfectly valid in balancing things, but in the end multipliers leading to higher effective spell power ratios are much, much better. It's basically the main reason Warlocks ended up so high in Sunwell compared to so many other classes, the fact that those multipliers on their damage worked so well.

I'm really afraid that if a stat to spell power route is taken then the effectiveness would slowly decrease as tiers improve. Stats don't happen to increase multiplicatively on gear upgrades, but spell power modifiers can as they all multiply together, leading to an exponential increase. Seeing as our scaling is mostly on an OK level at Naxx levels but peters out the higher tiers you look at, that exponential increase would work much better to solve our problems over a more linear increase.

I hate to make too strict of comparisons, but Moonkins are a great example of where we'll lose out comparatively without a more exponential scaling increase. For us, the effectiveness of crit decreases the more we get, while it actually increases for Moonkins. While higher spell power levels would initially off balance that, we'd need greater and greater percentage gains in spell power to equal the exponential scaling increase they receive. I've got a lot of the numbers in that regard, and I've been looking at making a post about it targeting the issue explicitly, I just haven't gotten around to it yet.

Edit addition:
Seeing as this is slowly just becoming the go to Shaman thread due to the GC effect, I may just make as concise of a post as possible in this thread. I'll just have to see how concise I can make it.

---

Q u o t e:

I play a druid. I play a shaman too. Elemental in fact. ;p I have many more. I don’t usually talk about my characters. I love them all as much as many of you probably love your characters.

---

Not as much as I love you GC.
Okay not really, but still.

---

Q u o t e:

I play a druid. I play a shaman too. Elemental in fact. ;p I have many more. I don’t usually talk about my characters. I love them all as much as many of you probably love your characters.

---

Thanks for you post.

Please play your elemental shaman competitively in 2v2 arena. We've overly weak in small scale PvP, and it would really help if someone at Blizzard would wallow around in that for a while and then work on fixing it. It's flatly not acceptable to make competitive 2v2 unavailable to elemental shaman.

I don't know what the fix is, but I know we're not competitive in that bracket. It doesn't have to be that way...

---

Q u o t e:


Thanks for you post.

Please play your elemental shaman competitively in 2v2 arena. We've overly weak in small scale PvP, and it would really help if someone at Blizzard would wallow around in that for a while and then work on fixing it. It's flatly not acceptable to make competitive 2v2 unavailable to elemental shaman.

I don't know what the fix is, but I know we're not competitive in that bracket. It doesn't have to be that way...

---

No one is likely to get changes to address deficiencies in 2v2. Blizzard has stated repeatedly in the past that they are aware 2v2 is not balanced, that they probably couldn't make it balanced, and they almost didn't include it at all for said reasons.

Here's my problem with this new idea (thank you for telling us about it) though, my gear isnt' pure spell power.

I have problems with haste due to having 4 abils on cd. crit is worthless for 25% of our rotations. I would seriously consider just stacking spell damage, but all of my gear is full of crit, haste, and mp5 in addition. if you give us a bigger bag per buck with spell power, its only going to make me find more gear that only has spell power, as that is already the most powerful stat for me.

Just picking out my probs with your ideas. Of course, warlock gear really isn't all that bad...

---

Q u o t e:


Yes, we get to determine what you can and can't complain about. It's our forum. Sorry. You can't complain about religion or politics. You can't complain about where I choose to post. You *can* complain about class balance or other aspect of game design as much as you want. If you make intelligent and useful complaints, I promise to read them.



I am talking about exclusively about level 80. That is the only thing that is going to matter to 99% of those players who worry about class balance in a little over a week.

You can do things (well, *we* can do things) like make 10,000 spell power gear and then see what the damage numbers look like. Assume Boomkin and Elemental dps was close at Naxx-level gear, but Boomkin pulled way ahead with the 10,000 spell power gear. That means Balance scales a lot better. That’s probably not a problem if it takes 10,000 spell power to get there, because there will be new levels and gear and everything will have changed by that time. If it takes 2000 or 3000 spell power then it probably is a problem.

We’d like to give Elemental either a talent that converts Int to spell power or gives a better spell power to damage conversion (or both). We just don’t know yet if we’ll do this through existing talents or new talents. I’ll announce it when we know.



I play a druid. I play a shaman too. Elemental in fact. ;p I have many more. I don’t usually talk about my characters. I love them all as much as many of you probably love your characters.

---

Here is the flaw in your logic GC. If elemental does not scale with increased spell power by the end of the WOTLK we will be diminished compared to other casters. No matter what if it does not scale as good as other spells other classes use your going to run into the same problem that happened in BC. By the end of the expansion people just end up stacking warlocks. And its not because warlocks benefited from shadow priest buffs like you think. Its because shadowbolt has always been the a better scaling spell, pure and simple and you can paint this situation any way you want and you will always have the same thing. COEFFICIENT IS EVERYTHING!.

Along with the fact you so wrong about us being fine at 80 it hurts my brain you keep giving us the DMV attitude.

Remember the end of War Games the movie. When there is a no win situation the best thing to do is not to play.

Ok people GC has pretty much made it official if you want to do caster dps pick the classes with the slowest spamable spells.

Warlocks and Druids.

---

Q u o t e:
We’d like to give Elemental either a talent that converts Int to spell power or gives a better spell power to damage conversion (or both). We just don’t know yet if we’ll do this through existing talents or new talents. I’ll announce it when we know.

---

Thank you. Either route would really serve well.

---

Q u o t e:
I have problems with haste due to having 4 abils on cd. crit is worthless for 25% of our rotations. I would seriously consider just stacking spell damage, but all of my gear is full of crit, haste, and mp5 in addition. if you give us a bigger bag per buck with spell power, its only going to make me find more gear that only has spell power, as that is already the most powerful stat for me.

---

Probably the best way of addressing that is to change the scaling by shifting more of it to nature damage spells, which will increase the appeal of crit and haste both. LvB already has a lot of scaling on it, new scaling talents that include it would have to be much weaker because of it. If LvB was left out of the new sclaing talent more importance would shift to our other spells and make our dps a bit less bursty.

That would fix the haste and crit issue that has been brought up I think. Though haste isnt too bad now, even with just a bit of scaling added to the rest of our rotation. I planned on using Glyph of Earth Shock in conjunction with Shamanistic Focus to round out my rotation and fit those LvB's in.

---

Q u o t e:
Ok people GC has pretty much made it official if you want to do caster dps pick the classes with the slowest spamable spells.

Warlocks and Druids.

---

/sigh Go away... you dont even know how they planned it to be implemented yet.