I can really see how the first incarnation of the felhunter part of the ability was OP (reset all felhunter cds) what with being able to chain spell locks and devours. The current incarnation seems it have turned the ability a full 180 and gone from being wildly good to 'when the heck would I use that?!?'.

I suggest that the felhunter demonic empowerment affect only devour magic and either have a chance to devour all magical debuffs off a friend or devour all magical buffs from an enemy on devours next cast. This would in my mind would make the ability useful and not overpowered.

Thanks,
Kargon

I think they've pretty clearly demonstrated they want affliction to use felhunter and demonology to use a pet besides felhunter.

Just look at the mana return from shadow bite in affliction.

I think their philosophy behind demonology is that the demonology warlock should not be pigeon-holed into using a particular pet. They need to buff the other pets, especially the felguard imo, to make them viable in pvp settings to counter other (non caster) threats. Please refer to my felguard suggestion for more.

As for shadowbite, i now chalk it up to lash of pain material. pretty worthless and only there to provide an extra attack.

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Q u o t e:

I think their philosophy behind demonology is that the demonology warlock should not be pigeon-holed into using a particular pet. They need to buff the other pets, especially the felguard imo, to make them viable in pvp settings to counter other (non caster) threats. Please refer to my felguard suggestion for more.

As for shadowbite, i now chalk it up to lash of pain material. pretty worthless and only there to provide an extra attack.

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An extra attack and mana return if you are affliction.

Felguard seems pretty good with demonic empowerment, he gets like mini beast within enrage. I wondered about maybe giving felguard pummel, but that might make it too good. Or maybe mini hamstring.

If you haven't noticed though demo buffs EVERY pet except felhunter. In part because I think blizzard felt that felhunter had become TOO ubiquitous with warlock PVP and they wanted to make the other pets more attractive. IE basline felhunter is "good enough" already to warrant using.

At level 70 with all dots up that melee attack hits for 250 on something 8 levels lower with no armor. That's half of what one of my dots ticks for at most. That's not a big deal no matter what spec you are. The felguard enrage damage isn't a big deal either, it is about 500 more damage out of him vs a clothie over the 15 second duration, the only thing to really care abou there is the stun/snare immunity so you can get him out of dodge when he's in trouble or you need him to get in range to intercept.

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Q u o t e:

At level 70 with all dots up that melee attack hits for 250 on something 8 levels lower with no armor. That's half of what one of my dots ticks for at most. That's not a big deal no matter what spec you are. The felguard enrage damage isn't a big deal either, it is about 500 more damage out of him vs a clothie over the 15 second duration, the only thing to really care abou there is the stun/snare immunity so you can get him out of dodge when he's in trouble or you need him to get in range to intercept.

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Yeah but everything you just said is true now, what do you want to change about the pets to make them better?

I want the felguard to gain a disarm (he has 3 abilities vs the other pets 4).
I want the voidwalker channeled ability to not only detect stealthers but knock them out of stealth as well.
I want Succubus' seduce to not share DR with fear and have some way to live longer.

I want pet attacks to go through resilience OR for them to have a base resilience which would scale up with their masters for all pets. Read my other suggestions both on this page and the next! :)

I want warlocks to have an unique buff that is actually worth bringing to raids. Right now the only one that isn't easily traded for is the demonology one, and you need some strong gear to make it outscale a shaman's totem. Give us something like fel infusion, your target becomes filled with anger and deals more damage at the cost of his health.

Ops, they already gave that to deathknights...

Heh, if only I could become useful in raids again.

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Q u o t e:
I doubt raid leaders are going to be bringing death knights just for Hysteria. The whole point is nobody brings something unique to raids so important that it gaurantees them a spot. Locks still have several very potent buffs -- it's just that there are other ways to get those now too.

The Felhunter was just too well-suited for PvP. There was no reason to bring any other pet.

We would like to get the Voidwalker a little more use besides just leveling though.

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So the solution was to divide both their powers making both of them useless. PERFECT!
But you guys are struggling here at the end, 'adding' things is out of the question.

There will be many sad destro locks

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Q u o t e:
I doubt raid leaders are going to be bringing death knights just for Hysteria. The whole point is nobody brings something unique to raids so important that it gaurantees them a spot. Locks still have several very potent buffs -- it's just that there are other ways to get those now too.

The Felhunter was just too well-suited for PvP. There was no reason to bring any other pet.

We would like to get the Voidwalker a little more use besides just leveling though.

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you ended up w/ a pet w/ no utility (VW) plenty of times because the felhunter just couldn't live due to lack of scaling...

I know whenever i saw a warrior in arenas (2v2) I would have to pretty much immediately start summoning a VW because I would never be able to peel a warrior from my pet and it just dies way too fast.

well, not vs shaman/pally teams but that's because those games didn't last long enough to make the lack of pet scaling that noticeable. I don't mean they never killed my pet nearly instantly but I would feldom voids because it plenty when they were switched because they just became a huge mana sink for the druid i was playing with.

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Q u o t e:
I doubt raid leaders are going to be bringing death knights just for Hysteria. The whole point is nobody brings something unique to raids so important that it gaurantees them a spot. Locks still have several very potent buffs -- it's just that there are other ways to get those now too.

The Felhunter was just too well-suited for PvP. There was no reason to bring any other pet.

We would like to get the Voidwalker a little more use besides just leveling though.

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That's a good intent GC, but realistically... We can't swap pets in the pinch that is PvP combat. Fully talented for summoning it's a 6seconds interruptable cast, bare minimum. I truly hope there is some work coming to help that issue if you realistically think that "a different pet for a different situation" is a viable combat choice for a warlock.

Either we need one reliable PvP pet.. As we once had. Or we need a solution to swap pets on the fly once we discover the situation.


This is a MAJOR gripe among warlocks. We need to guess the right pet before we know what we're up against, and then in non-arena situation, we need to guess the right place to drop a Demonic Circle. As it is right now, Warlocks in WotLK are not balanced around skill... They are balanced around precognition!

I'm unaware of another class who has to predict their opposing team comp before hand with regards to how they set up half their DPS and abilities (unalterable in combat)

I'd rather just /roll 1-4 before each arena and at least save the time / clicking aspect of this game of chance in the championed arena of skill

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Q u o t e:
I doubt raid leaders are going to be bringing death knights just for Hysteria. The whole point is nobody brings something unique to raids so important that it gaurantees them a spot. Locks still have several very potent buffs -- it's just that there are other ways to get those now too.

The Felhunter was just too well-suited for PvP. There was no reason to bring any other pet.

We would like to get the Voidwalker a little more use besides just leveling though.

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Any comment on the Imp being a better pet for raid DPS than the Felguard for deep demo? (rumor, haven't tested it myself tbh, so you could probably ignore this question until someone brings proof)

Or the issues with Demonic Empathy?
- The only pet that can get full use out of the buff is the imp since all his attacks are 'specials'
- The general inadequacy of the talent as compared to Ferocious Inspiration?

I really do want to like the Demonology tree, really, I do... but there are just so many talents in the tree that either make me shake my head wondering what I'm supposed to do with it, or honestly make me want to smack someone upside the head for thinking it was a good idea (looking at you Imp. Enslave Demon).

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Q u o t e:
I doubt raid leaders are going to be bringing death knights just for Hysteria. The whole point is nobody brings something unique to raids so important that it gaurantees them a spot. Locks still have several very potent buffs -- it's just that there are other ways to get those now too.

The Felhunter was just too well-suited for PvP. There was no reason to bring any other pet.

We would like to get the Voidwalker a little more use besides just leveling though.

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Any chance you might be able to increase his base threat, similar to what the tank classes got? =]