So last night I managed to rope a durid buddy into helping me with something that was bugging me.

I had him put up his FFF on a target dummy while I wrathspammed it naked, and specced pretty much only for Improved FF.
My crit chance while nuking was 3.53% according to tooltip, and I did not spec for Nature's Majesty. And I only had 4000 mana which was a total pain in the ass drinking after every 20 set of nukes lol.


Here's my raw dataz from recount. Remember, my base crit was 3.5% so an increase of 3% from IFF should be retardedly apparent. (And it is)

Against a unbuffed target dummy:
Set1:
Casts: 208
Crit %: 4.3%

Set2:
Casts: 201
Crit %: 3.4%

Set3:
Casts: 211
Crit %: 5.2%

My RNG loves me!

Next, against the same target dummy, my same 3.53% crit, but this time with FFF applied by a 0/51/10 druid. (He only had time to stay for a little bit, this took forever due to the dirnking)

Set1:
Casts: 204
Crit %: 8.8%

Set2:
Casts: 101
Crit %: 8.9%

Now we could just say its RNG streak, but I definitely think this talent feeds off of other peoples' faerie fire. I wish he could have stuck around more to get a full 3 runs in but it was understandably tedious. I used 60 biscuits >.<

What does this mean? If you've got a feral, and youve got a S priest.... You've got a free 3% crit!

VERY nice.

Oh, and bump ;)

Thanks for testing. However, Target dummies don't always have the same stacking mechanics as other mobs.... because you've been able to get the benefit from people outside your group.

There was a while where CoE and E&M were stacking on the target dummy, but not stacking on mobs.

However, it's interesting to see that the mechanic was working there. I'm just saying I'd prefer seeing it in action. In addition, I'd be happier seeing it on the Beta server, because in terms of bug fixes, I think the live server is a patch or two behind Beta.

Thanks for doing this testing, though. It's a good first step. ;o)

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Q u o t e:
Thanks for testing. However, Target dummies don't always have the same stacking mechanics as other mobs.... because you've been able to get the benefit from people outside your group.

There was a while where CoE and E&M were stacking on the target dummy, but not stacking on mobs.

However, it's interesting to see that the mechanic was working there. I'm just saying I'd prefer seeing it in action. In addition, I'd be happier seeing it on the Beta server, because in terms of bug fixes, I think the live server is a patch or two behind Beta.

Thanks for doing this testing, though. It's a good first step. ;o)

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We did it in silvermoon, the darnassus of horde. =p We were the only ones there and there were no errant buffs (except for his innervate LOL)

It will be much harder to discern "in action" as you say, because, well, lets face it. On a recount, RNG could very well affect you going from 40% to 43% crit. Thats only a ~8% variation for the RNG to conquer your mathz.

But going from 3.5% to 6.5% (technically) is a very large relative jump, RNG would have to be SERIOUSLY screwing with me to get those results. This is probably the most accurate way of testing crit.

Bump for great druid synergy justice!

Thanks for testing! While the refresh was keeping your IFF active, was he getting his damage boost from FFF?

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Q u o t e:
We did it in silvermoon, the darnassus of horde. =p We were the only ones there and there were no errant buffs (except for his innervate LOL)

It will be much harder to discern "in action" as you say, because, well, lets face it. On a recount, RNG could very well affect you going from 40% to 43% crit. Thats only a ~8% variation for the RNG to conquer your mathz.

But going from 3.5% to 6.5% (technically) is a very large relative jump, RNG would have to be SERIOUSLY screwing with me to get those results. This is probably the most accurate way of testing crit.

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right, but testing dummies have a way of acting differently than real mobs, which is what I'm cautious about. I've been known to mass slaughter low lvl mobs in starting areas to get testing on "real" things, but for this kind of talent, it's really just a pain in the neck, so I haven't done it.

I may need to pester Devs on the Beta forums to get a more clear picture of how it's supposed to work.

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Q u o t e:
Thanks for testing! While the refresh was keeping your IFF active, was he getting his damage boost from FFF?

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I didnt cast IFF at all. All he casted was FFF.

And @ Lis - The dummys don't resist spells (i dont think...) and some of them have no armor, but spell mechanics on the lv 70 ones should be the exact same as on a mob.

This sort of testing almost can't be done "in the field" persay except for maybe dr boom.... who is a target dummy ^^ Trust me, IFF's crit is working off of any faerie fire on the mob.

Wait, you didn't cast IFF *at all* and you got the crit, or you cast it once and he cast FFF afterwards and it refreshed?

If the first, that sounds completely wrong. If the second, was his damage component active as well? If you continuously cast IFF after he cast FFF was his damage component affected?

I'm just really curious here because I have a warlock friend where they have a talent that only the first lock who casts a buff gets the benefit.

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Q u o t e:
Wait, you didn't cast IFF *at all* and you got the crit, or you cast it once and he cast FFF afterwards and it refreshed?

If the first, that sounds completely wrong. If the second, was his damage component active as well? If you continuously cast IFF after he cast FFF was his damage component affected?

I'm just really curious here because I have a warlock friend where they have a talent that only the first lock who casts a buff gets the benefit.

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It looks like just having FF on the testing dummy (regardless of who cast it) was giving the personal CRIT bonus (not the hit bonus).

Given my bad experiences with testing dummies, I still don't trust it, but that's what his results are showing.

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Q u o t e:
Wait, you didn't cast IFF *at all* and you got the crit, or you cast it once and he cast FFF afterwards and it refreshed?

If the first, that sounds completely wrong. If the second, was his damage component active as well? If you continuously cast IFF after he cast FFF was his damage component affected?

I'm just really curious here because I have a warlock friend where they have a talent that only the first lock who casts a buff gets the benefit.

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I did not touch my faerie fire button at all. All I did was wrathspam + drink.

He was standing next to me spamming feral faerie fire only.

Meaning that, again, if you have a shadow priest to provide misery, and a feral keeping FFF up, you dont have to touch your FF button at all but still receive the 3% crit bonus, and the raid still gets 3% hit from misery.

go %@@* boom, he's a good one to try it on.

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Q u o t e:
go %@@* boom, he's a good one to try it on.

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ya, if it worked on Dr. Boom, I'd believe you and sing your praises. ;o)

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Q u o t e:
I did not touch my faerie fire button at all. All I did was wrathspam + drink.

He was standing next to me spamming feral faerie fire only.

Meaning that, again, if you have a shadow priest to provide misery, and a feral keeping FFF up, you dont have to touch your FF button at all but still receive the 3% crit bonus, and the raid still gets 3% hit from misery.

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Huh, surprisingly that completely agrees with the tooltip (for a change). It looks like I might just throw three points in there once we get our four points back.

Now, can you and your feral friend test whether or not he keeps his FFF AP damage if you have to cast IFF for the spell hit (i.e. if for some reason you don't run with an spriest)? ;)

Improved Faerie Fire — Rank 3
Your Faerie Fire spell also increases the chance the target will be hit by spell attacks by 3%, and increases the critical strike chance of your damage spells by 3% on targets afflicted by Faerie Fire.

I already specced out of it, someone else is gonna have to try it if you feel that strongly about it. The 100g respeccing to test this was enough to strongly convince me, and the data shows 100% correlation with the theory.

Tips when respeccing if one of you has a buddy you want to test for yourself with: Do not take the 4% starfire/wrath crit talent. Do not take moonkin form. Do it unbuffed and completely naked so that you have the lowest crit possible. The lower your base crit = higher the differencial is between X and X+3, which helps to offset RNG streaks statistically. Since you're wasting 100g to do this, spec for omen of clarity too so you get some free casts while nuking.

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Q u o t e:
I already specced out of it, someone else is gonna have to try it if you feel that strongly about it. The 100g respeccing to test this was enough to strongly convince me, and the data shows 100% correlation with the theory.

Tips when respeccing if one of you has a buddy you want to test for yourself with: Do not take the 4% starfire/wrath crit talent. Do not take moonkin form. Do it unbuffed and completely naked so that you have the lowest crit possible. The lower your base crit = higher the differencial is between X and X+3, which helps to offset RNG streaks statistically. Since you're wasting 100g to do this, spec for omen of clarity too so you get some free casts while nuking.

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Fair enough.

I'll get someone to help me do it on the Beta server (yay 1 copper respecs) this weekend... Why do it on live if I can do it for free in Beta?

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Q u o t e:


Fair enough.

I'll get someone to help me do it on the Beta server (yay 1 copper respecs) this weekend... Why do it on live if I can do it for free in Beta?

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I'm so madly jealous of that D=
I would love to play around with all sorts of specs, but I have two alts approaching 70, and I'm still reeling from getting their level 60 epic mounts.

Ah well, no moonkin play time for me =/

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Q u o t e:


Huh, surprisingly that completely agrees with the tooltip (for a change). It looks like I might just throw three points in there once we get our four points back.

Now, can you and your feral friend test whether or not he keeps his FFF AP damage if you have to cast IFF for the spell hit (i.e. if for some reason you don't run with an spriest)? ;)

Improved Faerie Fire — Rank 3
Your Faerie Fire spell also increases the chance the target will be hit by spell attacks by 3%, and increases the critical strike chance of your damage spells by 3% on targets afflicted by Faerie Fire.

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Now that...that is tricksy...

And awesome.

so if you're specced for iff, any other ff only gives you the crit but not the spell hit, correct?


i mangle english apparently, sorry.

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Q u o t e:
so if you're specced for iff, any other ff only gives you the crit but not the spell hit, correct?


i mangle english apparently, sorry.

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as of now, it appears that way.