I set out to check if ignites rolled in 2.1, after a rather embarassing event of me typoing my own results and getting very confused in the process, Muphrid saved the day, dummy checked me, and here are the results:


Trial 1:
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r120/nkthrasher/Misc/ignite_1.jpg

First four crits totaled:

1254 + 1323 + 1186 + 1164 = 4927 * .4 to get total ignite damage = 1970.8 / 2 to get per tick damage = 985.4

Looking at the screen shot you see the tick for 985 at 00:27:41

Then at 00:27:42 we get another crit

1845 * .4 = 738 / 2 = 369 per tick coming from it. Since we've already used one tick of the earlier ignite, the remaining 985.4 damage is evenly split over the next two ticks from this ignite.

369 + (985.4 / 2) = 861.7

And in the screenshot we see a tick for 862 at 00:27:45, another one occured at :47 off the bottom of the shot.



Trial 2:
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r120/nkthrasher/Misc/ignite_2.jpg
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r120/nkthrasher/Misc/ignite_3.jpg

1206 + 1279 + 1284 = 3769 * .4 = 1507.6 / 2 = 753.8

Seen at 01:06:25 with the 754 tick.

2064 * .4 = 825.6 / 2 = 412.8 + (754 / 2) = 789.8

Seen at 01:06:29 and 01:06:31



Trial 3:
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r120/nkthrasher/Misc/ignite_4.jpg

1210 * .4 = 484 / 2 = 242

Seen at 01:26:26

1294 + 1352 = 2646 * .4 = 1058.4 / 2 = 529.2 + (242 / 2) = 650.2

Seen at 01:26:31 and 01:26:33


Trial 4:
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r120/nkthrasher/Misc/ignite_5.jpg

1434 + 1464 + 2528 = 2170.4 / 2 = 1085.2

Seen at 01:41:36 and 01:41:38



Conclusion: The model for how ignite works is that successive crits build on each other, aproximately two seconds after the last crit the tick for all preceeding crits occurs.

If a tick occurs, then another crit happens, the remaining ticks worth of damage from the previous ignite is evenly split over the new ignites two ticks.

Ignites do not roll, you do not gain any extra damage from them.


A side note, I encountered the simult-crit bug four times while testing this, it is very much so alive.



Edit: http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/4512/yousuckattestingot3.jpg

It seems that through creative timing you can get a tick to occur and still distribute the tick over the following ignite. Using the screenshot from above (supplied by Wran):

1416 * .2 = 283.2

seen in that first ignite tick, the second tick goes off (assuming here, since Wran has no timestamps) at the same time the second crit does. Gets to do its 283 damage, then we add

1448 * .2 = 289.6 + (283.2 / 2) = 431.2 tick afterwards, which we see two of.

Regardless, conclusion stands, Ignites do not roll. You can cheat an extra tick out of it with lucky timing, but the model fo basic behavior stands.

It's been this way for months.

^^ Keylogger

http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/4512/yousuckattestingot3.jpg

I promised the next one of you dorks who posted this crap was going to be visited by burly men with bats. There is an ignite stacking bug, it is real, it DOES produce more than 40% ignite damage.

Expected ignite total: 1145
Actual Ignite total: 1428

Consider the men with bats sent.

Most excellent! Good work. ^^

A nice screenshot indeed, it still follows the model though.

The only thing thats different is it seems the timing of that last crit was such that it still absorbed a ticks worth of damage from the first ignite, since 1448 * .2 = 289.6 + (283/2) = 431.1

I dont suck at testing, you found an eventuality I did not, a quirk in the mechanics. Thats interesting though since the combat log shows the ignite debuff being recreated for the second one.

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Q u o t e:
A nice screenshot indeed, it still follows the model though.

The only thing thats different is it seems the timing of that last crit was such that it still absorbed a ticks worth of damage from the first ignite, since 1448 * .2 = 289.6 + (283/2) = 431.1

I dont suck at testing, you found an eventuality I did not, a quirk in the mechanics. Thats interesting though since the combat log shows the ignite debuff being recreated for the second one.

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I'm annoyed because I've been posting and reposting about this for literally 2 months now is all.

Nice, answered the questions I still had about Ignite (namely how it works nowadays).

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Q u o t e:
I'm annoyed because I've been posting and reposting about this for literally 2 months now is all.

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Honestly its the first time I've seen that particular screen shot, when was that taken?

I did some testing seeing if I can reproduce it, but it seems like its a tricky timing issue like the simult-crit bug, and timing a crit to happen on an ignite tick is much more difficult than just spamming fireblast as a pyro finishes.

Honestly though, considering the timing restriction on generating it, for theorycrafting purposes theres no reason to factor it in at all, as there is no fire spell that will be timed to hit two seconds following the previous unless you sit for half a second on a scorch, which isn't involved in theorycrafting.

If you can generate it again I'd love more screen shots of it, I can add them to my once-per-patch ignite bug report I send up to Blizzard.

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Q u o t e:


Honestly its the first time I've seen that particular screen shot, when was that taken?

I did some testing seeing if I can reproduce it, but it seems like its a tricky timing issue like the simult-crit bug, and timing a crit to happen on an ignite tick is much more difficult than just spamming fireblast as a pyro finishes.

Honestly though, considering the timing restriction on generating it, for theorycrafting purposes theres no reason to factor it in at all, as there is no fire spell that will be timed to hit two seconds following the previous unless you sit for half a second on a scorch, which isn't involved in theorycrafting.

If you can generate it again I'd love more screen shots of it, I can add them to my once-per-patch ignite bug report I send up to Blizzard.

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That testing was done yesterday about 10 minutes before I posted, because I didn't have any good ones from LIVE, only the PTR release right before (and I didn't think that would fly) However, I have been tracking this issue since mid april, and I do refer to it as a STACKING BUG (not rolling ignites). The full explanation for current ignite mechanics can be found here:

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=97830151

Including a description and screenshot of the bug, and discussion of the fact it doesn't really add THAT much DPS (in my testing after that particular ptr patch I found that for whatever internal time synching reason I had a hard time reproducing high damage-gain occurences. The "1 extra tick" occurence is still reproducible, but some of the very high numbers originally seen are NOT)

I'm as tired as anyone is of hearing about rolling ignites.

My best suggestion for reproducing this is to stack crit as high as you can, and spam scorch. A quick recap of your combat log over any significant length of testing will show it pop up once or twice. To get an idea of the actual DPS gain, I'd love to find a way to record total crit damage and total ignite damage (maybe WWS or SWS does this, not sure) to check for gain over a series of consecutive scorch crits.

Edit: One of the reasons you might have a harder time reproducing this is that your crit rate is almost 18-20% lower than what I was using on PTR for my initial testing (hooray tester gear!). My sample size of crits in the necessary time interval was a lot higher.

Hahah, whoops, I even posted in that thread too.

I remember that post, writing perl in wow forums is always memorable.