When are you guys going to get it? For what seems like well over a year now, we've seen our best players and friends leave our guild and move on to other guilds, both raiding guilds and otherwise. When people voice complaints, you ignore them or lie to them and tell them that their complaints are "being addressed". When people voice complaints on the forums, both privately and publicly, after you've bashed and flamed them, you delete or hide their posts from view, so that no actually discussion can take place. If someone quits the guild, you label them a complainer or a troublemaker.

Don't you think that maybe, just maybe, after we've lost so many good people - especially some of the ones who have been there since before The Shadow Hunters and Buccaneers of Azeroth merged - that you guys need to spend some time looking at yourselves and fixing the problems within the leadership and the attitudes you guys have?

When are you going to treat your members like equals and not as spot fillers? When are you going to stop being petty and selfish and fix what's broken?

Are you even going to try? Do you even care? Yes, yes, I know, Maelan and Bagheera are the leaders now, and the leadership change helped. For a while. But now, the same problems still exist today that existed over a year ago. I know, because I still see them. Constantly. Without fail, you do the same things and treat people the same disrespectful ways that you did back then.

And yes, I'm posting from an alt on the Aggramar forums because I'm guilded and don't want to deal with more in-game drama or have a sincere post deleted or removed from the forums because you don't want to deal with people who you view as "complainers".

So, this is a plea from someone who cares, who wants to see Legendary do well and straighten up. Fix things, guys. Please. Finally fix things.

Signed,

A concerned member

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Q u o t e:
When are you guys going to get it? For what seems like well over a year now, we've seen our best players and friends leave our guild and move on to other guilds, both raiding guilds and otherwise. When people voice complaints, you ignore them or lie to them and tell them that their complaints are "being addressed". When people voice complaints on the forums, both privately and publicly, after you've bashed and flamed them, you delete or hide their posts from view, so that no actually discussion can take place. If someone quits the guild, you label them a complainer or a troublemaker.

Don't you think that maybe, just maybe, after we've lost so many good people - especially some of the ones who have been there since before The Shadow Hunters and Buccaneers of Azeroth merged - that you guys need to spend some time looking at yourselves and fixing the problems within the leadership and the attitudes you guys have?

When are you going to treat your members like equals and not as spot fillers? When are you going to stop being petty and selfish and fix what's broken?

Are you even going to try? Do you even care? Yes, yes, I know, Maelan and Bagheera are the leaders now, and the leadership change helped. For a while. But now, the same problems still exist today that existed over a year ago. I know, because I still see them. Constantly. Without fail, you do the same things and treat people the same disrespectful ways that you did back then.

And yes, I'm posting from an alt on the Aggramar forums because I'm guilded and don't want to deal with more in-game drama or have a sincere post deleted or removed from the forums because you don't want to deal with people who you view as "complainers".

So, this is a plea from someone who cares, who wants to see Legendary do well and straighten up. Fix things, guys. Please. Finally fix things.

Signed,

A concerned member

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Why not step up and post this on your guild forums? Dont be scared to speak your mind.


This isnt the place to have a serious disscussion about the pros and cons of your guild. <- imo

In every guild I've been in there have always been two types of people. Those who work to fix problems and those who complain about how someone else needs to.

You don't need to be an officer to improve your situation.

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Q u o t e:

Why not step up and post this on your guild forums? Dont be scared to speak your mind.

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Reading comprehension, FTW.

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Q u o t e:

When people voice complaints on the forums, both privately and publicly, after you've bashed and flamed them, you delete or hide their posts from view, so that no actually discussion can take place.

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Q u o t e:

And yes, I'm posting from an alt on the Aggramar forums because I'm guilded and don't want to deal with more in-game drama or have a sincere post deleted or removed from the forums because you don't want to deal with people who you view as "complainers".

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Q u o t e:


Reading comprehension, FTW.

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lemme guess, you are #2...

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Q u o t e:

In every guild I've been in there have always been two types of people. Those who work to fix problems and those who complain about how someone else needs to.

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Q u o t e:


lemme guess, you are #2...

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... and you would be wrong.

I'm happy where I am... therefore, I have nothing to complain about.

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Q u o t e:
This isnt the place to have a serious disscussion about the pros and cons of your guild. <- imo

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According to the op neither is his guild forums.

To the concerned member of Legendary who felt that the best way to deal with an issue was to address it on some public forum and then make accusations that are totally unprovable.

As an officer of Legendary..... I have no idea what you are talking about in regards to your statements about posts to the forums.

Since I also manage the guild's forums, I can state for fact a few things.

We don't delete any posts.
We don't move posts so there is no discussion.
We have moved posts from the public area to the guild area so that our problems are not public.
We do have an officer only area and that is on purpose.

We encourage all points of views.

We do work hard to have a great guild.

But please.... don't come here talk trash about the guild. Be big enough to bring it home.

oh snap

I am a GM of Legendary.

Cairname speaks the truth, posts are not moved to avoid discussion, and when I move posts (or any of my officers does) we put them in places where the poster still has access.

Even in cases where an officer quits the guild (has happened recently), they have retained access to the officer forums to have opportunity to complete the discussion(s) they started for at least 24 hours and normally longer.

As to addressing problems (since it's now in a public forum)...

I ask who else feels that way when someone brings a complaint to me. Why? Simply because 1 unhappy person is not 185 other accounts in the guild unhappy. You cannot jerk a 100+ players direction around on a whim because one person felt left out of some run or feels like they cannot get help. But when you ask for specifics, you get "I can't say." "I told them I wouldn't tell."

Sorry, but I can't run a guild and change rules on hearsay. If my members have a problem, they are welcome to bring them and address them. As to flaming them, no. Some people take any criticism as a flame, and not getting their change made = I did not listen to them. I'm not claiming to be perfect, just providing a different perspective.

I can only help 4 other people do any given thing at a time and that's if all 4 others need the same thing... 5 man groups anyone? and I can only participate in 1 kara run, so that would be 9 others.

I don't play favorites, I have never refused to help anyone who's asked. I may tell them they have to wait until later or tomorrow, but I will help them. If it's a lower level toon, I will help usually by using a lower level alt. I don't believe in L70's running people through everything, especially on their first toon. If it's someone just trying to level an alt, it's a little different.

Anyway, guess this isn't going any further and I'm rambling, so see you in game.

Maelan
(No time for fancy sigs, too much else to do.)

to those who think that legendary sucks because of it's progression, you need to realize that legendary moves slow because it's a behemoth. It's one of the largest guilds on the server in number of accounts in it, and has had many a top raider born out of it. Yeah, Legendary has some progression issues, but that's because it's so huge...a leet raiding guild is kept small for a reason...it's easier to organize, manage, and maintain the raid roster. Legendary has to jump through many extra hoops just to get moving, and considering it's size, it's surprising that it's moving at all.

So all of ya dissing the progress? Legendary is more of a family guild...yeah, we raid, but it's not the first thing on our mind...

First of all, I don't think anyone is "dissing" the progession of the guild. Secondly, I think you're missing the point of the OP's post. This was not an attempt to bash the guild, but a plea. It was a desperate attempt to get their point across since it obviously won't be done on your own forums.

Cairname, you said, "Legendary has worked very hard for all people to be heard. We continue to try to do something that is difficult to do and we are asking for patience. "

Obviously that's not true, based on the emmigration of Kolor and Albion and Erius and whomever posted on these forums. Obviously some issues are not getting addressed. Obviously some people are genuinely unhappy but want things to change for the better.

You want to say "Oh we're doing a great job!" Yet people are leaving; founders of your guild are leaving. Get your heads out of your butts and look at the problems going on in your guild. And for anyone wanting to judge: Erius posted on their forums addressing a problem that needed to be solved and one of the officers told him to grow up. Yeah, great way of handling this situation. No wonder people come on here to post.

Who dissed the progress?

eh, they've been dissed in the past...I should just delete my post >_<

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Q u o t e:
eh, they've been dissed in the past

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By you right? Or was that your brother?

No, it wasn't either of us...and if you're gonna argue with me, do it via PM at the guild forum...doesn't belong here.

you must know that by the time you have to ask the officers not to act like incompetent arses, its quite too late. tho everyone loves a good gossipy thread, rant on.

tis true that Erius posted something and someone told him a lot of things. Does that mean we squashed discussion? not in the least. It was open and no one held back anything. Are people allowed to have opinions yes.

Does it mean that we have part of our bodies stuck up in other places? no...

There is nothing wrong with the leadership. Outside of the fact that we have lives outside of WOW. There is nothing in leadership that says we are not listening. Erius didn't like the response, was hurt, offended and took his play elsewhere. All this took place in less than 24 hours. He posted, and quit before most of the officers even saw his posts. So, who really is at fault here? The poster who took offense and now wants to prove his case in a public forum, or the leadership that didn't have a chance really to "listen" as you put it.

Just because people didn't agree with him doesn't mean that he is right. And coming here and making bold statements that we are doing this and that... doesn't prove a thing outside of he knows how to type on a keyboard.

There isn't a perfect guild in existence anywhere. I will not take the time to address anything here other than the poster didn't give the guild a fair shot and now there are claims that leadership is repeating past mistakes because of what he "thinks" is happening.

People can leave anytime if they are unhappy. But it is amazing how when people leave all of a sudden there supposedly is a mass exodus.... that is hardly truth in regards to Legendary. The guild is still strong and holding its own thank you. Four people leaving doesn't mean much, even the people of their levels and quality. Did we want them to leave? no... we would have preferred they improved the guild but we didn't get a chance to do that, they bailed before leadership had a chance to do anything. Are they allowed, absolutely.

So before you determine that we have anything stuck up anywhere... walk a bit in our shoes.

I was one of the officers who spoke initially with Erius. I disagreed with him right off the bat. I agree there was a problem, but his analysis was inaccurate from my viewpoint. He didn't even have a beef with the officers or even leadership. His beef was with how raiding was conducted and that ideal all the officers agree. Once again, we get down to who didn't listen and who isn't paying attention.

Within 24 hours of having that discussion with me, Erius posted, and quit. That gives leadership lots of time to address nothing....

Erius was not treated poorly, nor was Abion, Kolor or anyone else for that matter. He was treated as an equal and for that we are condemned. Stunone.... you're barking up the wrong tree.